Join us for an enlightening episode as Steve Gregg answers listener questions about religion and spirituality. The show begins with an exploration of the Gospel of Nicodemus, including its historical context and authorship. Steve breaks down complex theological debates about end times, providing a comprehensive understanding of what scripture says about the future and how to interpret these passages. The episode covers a range of topics, from the discussion about firstfruits offerings and tithing practices to where Christians might go after death. Listeners engage with biblical promises, questioning if they’re meant to be seen as guarantees or guidelines within
SPEAKER 1 :
Thank you.
SPEAKER 02 :
Good afternoon and welcome to the Narrow Path Radio Broadcast. My name is Steve Gregg and we’re live for an hour each weekday afternoon. And I just returned this morning from Seattle. I’ve been doing the show all last week from Washington State. And boy, I was busy too, teaching a lot of different places as I have been You know, the previous month in places like Northern California and Texas and the month before that in Tennessee and Arizona, I’ve had a busy two and a half months. But I’m not going to be traveling anymore for a little while. So I’m glad to be home, back at my own desk. And, of course, it didn’t change much about the broadcast because I’m broadcasting remote, too, because At my own home, I’m simply connecting with the KPVQ Studios in Portland, Oregon, which is producing the program and has produced it for years. And all I have to do when I’m on the road is that very thing, connect with that studio by internet. And that’s what I do, and that’s why I’m able to travel all the time and still do the program, usually live. And today, we’re doing it live. Our lines are full, but I’m going to give you the phone number anyway, because you may want to call in a while. This would not be a good time, since you’ll get a busy signal but if you call in a few minutes there are lines that will be opening up all the time the number to call if you have questions about the Bible or the Christian faith or maybe a disagreement with the host you want to talk about the number is 844-484-5737 that’s 844-484-5737 and we’re going to go to the phones right now since some people have been waiting for a while already And we’re going to talk to Michael from Denver, Colorado. Hi, Michael. Welcome.
SPEAKER 08 :
Steve, thank you so much for taking my call and always for imparting your wisdom and sharing so much amazing information with us. I just had a quick kind of question today, and then I’ll take my answer off the air. So I was reading something this weekend, interesting, about the Gospel of Nicodemus, which, you know, it was left out of the Bible, also known as the Acts of Pilate. But in the Gospel of Nicodemus, it talks about and names the soldier who pierced Jesus’ side as longinus during the crucifixion. And You’re probably aware, but stories about Longinus have been passed down through generations, talking about how he went on to preach the gospel and was killed because of his faith during a time when Christianity was outlawed. But obviously Nicodemus is mentioned in the Bible, but this wasn’t included as far as his naming of Longinus. And, you know, I’m curious just to get your opinion on why this was excluded from the Bible and just your overall kind of thoughts on that.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, the reason that the gospel of Nicodemus was not included in the Bible is because, according to most scholars, it dates from the 4th or 5th century AD. And this is the problem with so many of the apocryphal gospels that came out after the apostles were dead. A lot of people wrote Stories of Jesus, fictional stories of Jesus, sometimes they incorporated true stories of Jesus. For example, the Gospel of Thomas, about a third of it actually is just quoting things from the real Gospels, things that Jesus said and so forth. There are about two-thirds that are made up and fictional, and Thomas didn’t write it. but it claims to be written by the Apostle Thomas, but it was written a century or two after Thomas was dead, so obviously it wasn’t written by him. The Gospel of Nicodemus is in exactly the same category, though it probably was written even later than what we call the Gnostic Gospels. There are the Gospel of Philip, the Gospel of Thomas, the Gospel of Mary, the Gospel of Judas. There’s also a Gospel according to Peter. All of these were written a century or more after the death of the Apostles by Nicodemus, anonymous writers who claimed to be somebody famous, which would be a way of making their story somewhat credible. And the Gospel of Nicodemus, or as you said, it’s sometimes called the Acts of Pilate, is another book of that sort, only it’s even later. So it was never taken out of the Bible for the simple reason it was never in the Bible. By the time it was written, the whole New Testament canon had been completed, and that completion of the canon was had been a process of 300 years or so of the church trying to decide and make sure they had the right authentic Gospels from authentic writers. So, I mean, it never was in the Bible and never belonged in the Bible. Same with the Gnostic Gospels of the second and third century. Now, as far as the Gospels that are in our Bible, what we call the canonical Gospels, they’re in the canon of the New Testament. they were written anonymously, interestingly enough. The writers didn’t feel like they had to put someone famous’s name on them to give them credibility. They didn’t put a name on them at all. All four of the Gospels in our Bible were written anonymously. But the reason we know them as the Gospel of Matthew, the Gospel of Mark, the Gospel of Luke, and the Gospel of John, as we do, is because the first century church, received these books from their authors and knew who they were, obviously. I mean, it’s not like these books just showed up somewhere and someone said, I wonder who we should attribute, let’s attribute this book to Mark. No, Matthew, Mark, and Luke, and John were in the churches. I mean, they were not hermits living out in a cave somewhere and a book showed up and someone thought maybe they wrote it. They were in fellowship in the churches, just like the people in churches are. that you might go to, let’s just say if your pastor wrote a book, it would be known to the congregation that he wrote it, even if he published it anonymously. And that’s how it was with the four Gospels. They didn’t have to put a name on them. They didn’t have to pretend to be anyone. They were somebody. And the church knew who they were. So that’s why we have the four Gospels we do. They really were written by Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Even though skeptics and liberals often will say no, that the Gospels weren’t written by anyone living anywhere near the time of Jesus. Well, let them prove that. Let them prove that. We can’t prove when they were written, but the only testimony we have from people who actually knew the apostles give us those names. So I wonder what their sources, what the modern people’s sources are for saying, no, that wasn’t them. I’d rather trust the people who actually knew the apostles and knew where those books came from and told us and kept track of who wrote them than somebody living 2,000 years later who’s just got a theory that they didn’t write them So, Gospel of Nicodemus, interesting stuff. There’s always a lot of interesting stuff in this Gnostic Gospels and so forth, but the reason they’re not in the Bible is because they’re not biblical. So, I appreciate your call, brother. Let’s see, we’re going to talk next to Alan from Manchester, Connecticut. Alan, welcome.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, it’s always an honor to be talking to you. I’m on the road a lot, so you’ve talked to me from different cities. and our beautiful Connecticut in the springtime. Now, here’s the question. We’re learning a new series in my congregation about the book of Hebrews, and one of the people was saying, I’m questioning the deity of Jesus now. The book of Hebrews said that Jesus is more honored than the angels because he’s God’s son. Now, the question was this. when somebody said to him, good teacher, Jesus said, why do you call me good? Only God is good. Can you explain to us what he meant by that?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I can try. He didn’t explain what he meant. And some people think that he was saying he was not God, which would be a strange thing for him to say since so many other times he said things that would indicate that he is at least one with God or that if you’ve seen him, you’ve seen God. And, and so forth. So, you know, it seems like it’d be strange if he’s trying to rebuke this guy and say, hey, I’m not God, don’t call me good. You know, when he said, why do you call me good? There’s none good but God. We might ask, is he saying that he’s not God and therefore not good? Or is he saying that he’s God? And the fact that this man recognized him as good should tip him off since good is is uniquely a trait of God and that, you know, no one was as good as God except Jesus. And the man that saw Jesus called him good had not recognized him to be God. And he could be saying, well, you know, only God is really good. But he’s not saying that means I’m not. Because how strange would it be for Jesus to say, I’m not good, don’t call me good, when he himself called himself good. He said that no one could accuse him of sin. He calls himself the good shepherd. You know, I mean, he’s as good as they get, you know. So I don’t think that, I mean, it seems to me that the statement, there’s none good but God, when in that context where somebody called him good, is he correcting them or is he extending their understanding further than it had already gone? He’s either saying, I’m not good or I’m not God, right? And some people feel like he’s saying he’s not God, but that leaves us with the only alternative. He’s saying I’m not good. And if he’s not good, who is? And why would he say that? I mean, if the guy had come and called him God, and Jesus said, hey, don’t call me God. There’s only one God. But lots of people are called good. I mean, the truth is God is not the only person who is good. Because there’s lots of people in the Bible who are called good men. You can just look at the concordance. There’s men who are good men. And we’re supposed to be doing good. We’re not as good as God. But the whole point is there would be nothing wrong about calling Jesus good. He obviously was good. And for him to deny that would be very peculiar. So I think he’s simply saying the ultimate good is God himself. and you see me as a good person, you see me as a good teacher, and I won’t deny that that is true, but it’s true because God is good, and I am identified with him, and so forth. It’s a peculiar statement, because we, especially Christians, have focused on those verses in the Bible where Jesus is called God, or is said to be God in the flesh, or those kinds of things. But, yeah, it’s, like I said, a peculiar statement, but we can only take it one of two ways that I know of. And the only reasonable way is for him to say, yeah, I am good because I’m God. You should have figured that out by knowing how good I am. So, anyway, I could be wrong about that, but I don’t know of anyone who’s had a better explanation of that peculiar statement.
SPEAKER 01 :
All right.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, thank you, Alan. There’s a lot of noise on your line, but I’m glad you called and we got your call in. Let’s talk to Ward in Eugene, Oregon. Ward, welcome to The Narrow Path.
SPEAKER 03 :
Hi, Steve. Hi. Thank you. There’s teaching going around that we should bring our tithes into the local church, and I know your teaching is on that. Now I’ve heard them say we should also bring our firstfruits offerings, into the local church as well. I haven’t heard too much about firstfruits offering.
SPEAKER 02 :
Are they setting up an altar to burn those firstfruits at the church? No. Well, that’s what they did. They bring the firstlings of their sheep and the firstfruits of their crops, and they would burn them at the temple on an altar. So if they’re saying, well, we ought to be doing that, Well, they better set up a barbecue, and everyone who brings their first fruits, put them on the fire. You know, these people who think that their local assembly is the equivalent of the temple in Jerusalem are, I don’t know, they’ve got delusions of grandeur or something. Your local church is not the temple. If it’s anything like anything in the time of Christ, it’s like the synagogue. The synagogues were the local assemblies of the Jews on Sabbath, and they would resemble in their protocols our local churches. They’d hear the Bible would be expounded on there. People would pray together. I don’t know if they sang. They probably did. I don’t know if they did or not. I mean, the kind of local worship center for… Every Jew was the synagogue in his own town. Now, the tithes were not taken to the synagogue. They were taken to the temple. To us, the temple, it does not correspond to any local church. It corresponds to the body of Christ, which is also a temple. It’s the temple of God made of living stones. And, you know, every local church represents, you know, the body of Christ in some measure. But But there’s nothing in the Bible that ever talks about bringing tithes to the local assembly. In fact, there’s nothing in the New Testament about tithes at all. There’s no command to bring tithes nor first fruits. So if a pastor thinks that people aren’t given enough money and he’d like to get more of that money out of them, He can go into the Old Testament, and I’ve known pastors who’ve told them they need to triple tithe because there were three tithes of the Jews in the Old Testament. Oh, now let’s go to the first. Let’s have them bring their firstborn cows and sheep and so forth. What else can we do? How about the first car you buy, you give it to the pastor. You know what I mean? This is bad. This is really bad. I mean, the truth is, Every Christian is devoted to Christ, and everything that person owns is devoted to Christ. Now, many Christians do not steward the things that they are supposed to be stewarding in a good way. And Jesus told a few parables about that and said when the Master comes back, those people who are not very good stewards… are going to be very much sorry, because there will be consequences for more or less wasting the master’s things that you’ve been given. In the New Testament, God doesn’t own 10%. He owns 100%. And as far as how much you may give to the local church, or if you give any at all to the local church, that would be just part of your own stewardship planning. Let’s say I mean, there are certainly people who could give 50% to the Lord, and that should be given through the body of Christ, which is the true temple, but the local church isn’t the same thing as that. But, you know, if you go to a church, excuse me, the Bible does say that, you know, people who are taught should share financially with those who teach them. It says that in Galatians chapter 6 and verse 6, I think it is, and Of course, you know, the church, if you’re going to church and if you’re being fed there, if they’re discipling you and giving you the word of God, well, you should give something to them. And, you know, it could be 10% if that’s what you feel led to do. I don’t say people can’t, but it should never be thought that you owe the church 10%. And frankly, some people don’t get very much teaching at their church and they realize that there’s better ways to spend the money, God’s money, God’s projects. But, you know, I say if I went to a church that kind of told people they were supposed to tithe, and I had kind of started going to church on sort of the unspoken agreement that I would tithe, I wouldn’t have any problem giving them 10%. That’s not a problem to me. But I would really not wish to give the impression that once I’d given 10% to them or anyone else, that I now had 90% To use on my own lifestyle. You know, it’s 100% belongs to God. You must use some of it to support your standard of living. But if you’re a good steward, you’re going to want to spend as little as possible on that part. Because, I mean, God’s going to ask you. I told you to be, you know, with food and clothing to be content. You know, and help the poor. And you’re laying up treasures in heaven when you help the poor. And you shouldn’t be laying up treasures on earth for yourself. You should be laying up treasures in heaven. So, I mean, these are the teachings of the master who owns the stuff that we’re managing for him. So, obviously, we should be doing all we can. to live frugally off the smallest portion possible of the things that we are stewarding, and then the rest of it belongs to God. And we should do the kinds of things with it that God feels are in advance of his interests. Helping the poor is a very important one. Supporting missionaries and, you know, maybe prison ministries, campus ministries, all kinds like that, in addition to the local church. would be right. And even, frankly, even helping someone in your town, a Christian brother or sister who are falling on hard times, giving to them is giving to the temple because they’re part of the temple. They’re part of the body of Christ. So, you know, stewardship is the New Testament teaching. Tithing is not a New Testament teaching. And unfortunately, because pastors do teach tithing, people get the impression, well, I gave my tithes, so I pretty much discharged my duty with my money. I can do whatever I want with the rest. And this is perhaps the bad fruit that comes of churches teaching you need to tithe, which the Bible won’t support them in that. Now, I would say this, too. I think one reason pastors teach that you should tithe is because they’ve got stingy members who don’t even give a tithe. To my mind, in America, we make so much money, I would think tithing would be a very minimal thing to give to the Lord anyway. I mean, there are people poor enough, so poor that they can’t even give 10% to others because they have to feed their children and so forth. They just don’t have it. And they shouldn’t feel guilty if they don’t tithe. God just wants you to use his stuff in the way that furthers his interests. If you’re dirt poor… and you’ve got kids to raise, well, it serves his interest for you to feed those kids and to put a roof over their heads. So we shouldn’t be thinking in terms of 10%. We should just be thinking in terms of how much do I have, how much can I divest in things that will promote the interests of the kingdom of God. And that’s what we should be thinking instead of tithing. And like you weren’t talking about tithing but giving firstfruits, For a church to say you need to tithe and then you need to give firstfruits too, well, that’s really a scheme. There’s nothing in the Bible to support that. We’re not living under the old covenant. We don’t bring animals and sacrifice them, and that’s what they did with their firstfruits. So I’d say I wouldn’t go to a church if they pushed that doctrine. Okay. Thank you so much, Steve. Okay, Ward. God bless you, man. Okay, we’re going to talk next to, let’s see, it’s going to be Sammy in Dallas, Texas. Hi, Sammy, welcome.
SPEAKER 10 :
Hi, thank you. In some where I’ve been traveling, I’ve seen other churches, and I’m hearing the term now, and I’ve heard it for a long time, that we’re living in the end times. Now, I kind of know what they mean by that, but what would be your definition of end times? What do they mean by it? And in your opinion, are we living in the end times? And why or why not?
SPEAKER 02 :
Okay, when people use the word end times, they’re not really using what I’d see as a biblical term. I mean, I can’t say there’s no reference to end times in the Bible, but it certainly is not a common biblical term. Last days would be a more common term. The last days, some people think, that God told Daniel that in the end times or the end of times, there’s going to be knowledge increasing and things like that in Daniel 12. But it doesn’t say the end of time. It says the time of the end. The question is the end of what? In my opinion, most of the prophecies that talk about the end of something or the last days of something are not talking about the end of the world. In their context, they’re generally speaking, talking about the end of the Second Temple Jewish system, which ended in AD 70, which is why, of course, all the apostles indicated in their writings that they were living in the last days. Now, you say, what do people mean when they say the end times? Well, the people who use it, that term, again, they’re mostly not citing Scripture by the use of that term, but there is a category of time that they are referring to as the end times, and they mean by that the times just very near the end of the world. The end in that statement, in their usage, would mean the end of the world. And they would be arguing that the end of the world is near. If we’re in the end times, the end of the world is near. I don’t think we have any information in the Bible that would tell us if the end of the world is near. The Apostles Ask Jesus in Acts chapter 1 and verse 6, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel? And Jesus’ answer in Acts 1-7 was, it’s not for you to know the times and the seasons that the Father has put in his own power. Just go out and preach the gospel and occupy yourself. and receive the Holy Spirit and go out and be witnesses. But he said, don’t be thinking about things that aren’t yours to think about. It’s not yours to know the times and the seasons that the Father has put in his power. So in my opinion, there’s lots of different times and seasons that God has put in his power, but the end of the world would certainly be in that category. God has decided when that’s going to be. And knowing the time and the season of that is, if Jesus said it’s not for you to know, Why would you want to try to figure it out? I mean, it’s amazing how people ignore what Jesus said because of their curiosity about things that he doesn’t want them to know. It’s not for them to even worry about. It’s a distraction. It’s a distraction from doing the will of God is what it comes down to. Because God has something for us to do. Like if you’re working in a shop or something and you’re always watching the clock. especially if you have some detailed work you should be attending to. If you’re looking at the clock all the time, every second you spend looking at the clock, you’re not attending to your responsibility. We don’t need to watch the clock. The bell will ring when it’s time to go home. And so we can just work and keep our mind on the thing that we’re told to do and try to keep our minds off what we’re told not to do. We’re told not to think about those things. So that’s how I would understand it. But that’s what they mean. They mean the end of the world. Okay, let’s see. We’re going to talk to Tony from East Sound, Washington. Hi, Tony. Welcome.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah, hi. I lost my mother in December, and she was a Christian, which I’m glad. I am too. And do you have any idea if it says anywhere in the Bible? I’ve been wondering where…
SPEAKER 02 :
Where she is? Heaven is. Okay. Well, the Bible doesn’t tell us where heaven is, meaning the spiritual place where God and the angels live and where I believe the Christian spirit goes at death. It doesn’t tell where it is. I mean, Paul said in one of his sermons, he says that God is not far from any of us. In him we live and move and have our being. So since God is in heaven, it may be that heaven is not very far at all. Maybe it’s just a different place. dimension or different realm. We don’t know. That’s one of those things that we’re not really told much about. But if she is a Christian, as you said, then she is in the presence of God. And it wouldn’t matter at all where heaven is. I don’t even care about heaven. I care about God. I want to be with God. And that’s where she is if she died as a follower of Christ. So I hope that’s helpful to you. We don’t know where to look for heaven. I don’t think Elon Musk will find it by going to space. It’s something that It can’t be seen that way. I need to take a break, so I appreciate we have another half hour coming up. Our website is thenarrowpath.com. Stay tuned. In about 30 seconds, I’ll be back. We’ll take another half hour of calls.
SPEAKER 01 :
See you next time.
SPEAKER 02 :
Welcome back to the Narrow Path Radio Broadcast. My name is Steve Gregg and we’re live for another half hour taking your calls. Looks like there may be one line open if you want to call at this time if you have questions about the Bible or the Christian faith or you disagree with the host and want to talk about that. The number to call is 844- 484-5737. That’s 844-484-5737. Our next call is from Karen in Covington, Washington. Hi, Karen. Welcome to The Narrow Path. Thanks for calling.
SPEAKER 09 :
Hi, Steve. I love your show. I have a question about Psalm 91 and some of the other psalms where it talks about… like none of his bones will be broken and just all of the things that happen to somebody that takes refuge in God. And I know people die and everything, but it’s hard to… Do you take the Psalms as being generally true, or how would you look at those things? those kind of things that look like promises.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, the Old Testament has a number of statements of that type, which look like promises, that say things like, if you’re a bad person, it’s going to really go badly for you. God’s going to judge you. God’s going to get you. Whereas, on the other hand, if you’re a righteous person, then God’s going to bless you and take care of you and protect you and all that kind of thing. That’s kind of a general theme of most of the Psalms. And of the Proverbs, too. And so how are we to understand that? Because we know it’s not always true. I mean, Jesus was good. Jesus was good. It didn’t go well for him. The apostles were good. They got martyred and beaten and imprisoned and lived in poverty. So, I mean, obviously it’s not the case. And the Bible doesn’t really mean to give the impression that it’s the case that if you do well… everything will always go well for you. For example, Job is one of the oldest, most people think it’s the oldest book in the Bible. So it was written long before the Psalms. It was long before the Proverbs. The authors of those books knew about Job. And Job is the most righteous man of his generation, and the most horrible things happened to him. And God allowed it to happen. It was basically said to be that God allowed Satan to do those things to him. So it could hardly be thought by anyone else who had access to the book of Job, that one could just count on, it’s all going to be good, you won’t break a bone, won’t stub your toe, nothing will go wrong if you’re a good person and pleasing to God. Well, Job was very pleasing to God, and everything went wrong for him. Of course, God did reward him afterwards, but that’s just the point. Was he more righteous at the time that God rewarded him, or more righteous at the time that God allowed him to be trialed? Well, both. He wasn’t more righteous one or the other. He was equally righteous at all times. Joseph was like that, too. Joseph was very greatly favored because of his integrity and his righteousness. But he was also put in jail and spent a good portion of his young life, you know, in a third-world prison, falsely accused. I mean, that’s not a good thing. And I mentioned Jesus, classically, or the prophets. Jeremiah… You know, he got put in prison. Isaiah got sawn in two. And they were God’s, you know, spokesmen and righteous men. So we have to say the Bible does not intend to teach that what those Psalms sound like they’re saying. I think we have to understand that those Psalms are saying that God does protect his own. that in Psalm 34, it says that the angel of the Lord encamps around about those who fear him and delivers him. Just like, frankly, Satan complained that God had put a hedge around Job so that Satan couldn’t hurt him. But God did let Satan hurt him in order to test him. And David, who said, you know, God puts his angel around those who fear him and delivers him, didn’t protect David from having to flee from his home. He did protect him from being killed by Saul, though he obviously died of something else. So he was driven out of his kingdom by armies under his own son Absalom. Bad things happen to good people. That certainly is one of the main themes of the Bible, in fact. So when you see statements that seem rather Pollyanna-ish, you know, well, just be good. And God will make sure everything goes well for you. We have to understand that’s got to be qualified in some way. The way I’ve seen it is that we’re to understand that if God wishes to keep us safe from all harm, he’s able to do that. He’s got his angels. He can put a hedge around us. And that means that we can count on that being his normal policy. Except when it isn’t. And that’s the point. God’s not one-dimensional. He’s a real father who wants to bless his children but also disciplines his children and tests them and things like that. So sometimes he’ll protect them from any harm. And I think those kinds of psalms and proverbs that say those kinds of things, what they’re saying is no worries. Whatever enemies you have, whatever dangerous time you live in, no matter how low your resources run, God is capable of and willing, in most cases, to protect you from them. And you don’t have to worry about a thing because God is there. Now, it also means that if something bad does happen to you, and he does deliver you over to them, that you can rejoice in the fact that this is not some random thing that happened because God wasn’t able to protect you, but this is a a measured experience measured out by God’s own will who loves you and intends good for you, which is why the Bible can say all things work together for good to those who love God and who are called according to his purpose. Obviously, Romans 8, 28. So the point is that God can work all things for good, but some of the things that have to be worked are things that aren’t in themselves good or pleasant or easy to go through. So One should not think that if you have enough faith, you’ll never be poor, you’ll never be persecuted, you’ll never be sick. All the righteous people in the Bible experience one or another of those things, and several of them. So, yeah, that’s what I think. I think that what it’s saying is God does this for his children, except when he has something else to do, except when he has another plan. But the fact that we’re assured that he does this when he wants to, means that even those times when he doesn’t protect us, it’s not just a bad luck. It’s that God had a purpose because he could protect you all the time. It’s like when Jesus was ministering and his enemies took up stones to stone him frequently. They wanted to kill him. Once they tried to throw him off a cliff. And the Bible says it wasn’t his hour. It wasn’t his time. So he just walked through the crowd and escaped. It’s obvious that God did not let his enemies hurt him. And yet, when… It was time for him to die. He did let his enemies catch him. God did let the enemies arrest him and beat him and kill him and do all those horrible things to him. And it’s interesting, too, because when Jesus was praying in the garden before he was arrested, he said, Father, if it’s your will, let this cup pass from me. And this cup meaning the suffering that he was about to go through. He didn’t say, you know, well, he just he submitted. He had he gave his request. But he yielded to the Father’s will, knowing that the Father’s will is always best. And when the soldiers came to arrest him after that, and Peter tried to defend him, Jesus said, hey, leave that alone, Peter. The cup that the Father has given me, shall I not drink it? Now, notice he prayed that God would protect him from that cup. But when God didn’t, he said, well, then my Father has given me this cup. I think this is what we can say, that I pray that we, you know, that we don’t get sick. We pray that we don’t have war. We pray that we don’t have economic disaster. We pray for those things because we should make our request known to God. But we do so knowing that he is a good God who has more than one way of dealing with us for our good or for his purposes. And that he may in fact say, I hear your request here, but I have a better idea. It’s not going to be what you wanted but it’ll turn out you’ll be glad i did you know it’s uh so you know these statements that seem very simplistic oh if you do the right thing life will be good that’s exactly the theology that job’s friends held and when job then suffered they were convinced he must not have been doing good they had this theology it was too simplistic But if they had lived later, they could have gotten that theology from reading certain Psalms and Proverbs. But we have to realize that the Psalms and Proverbs are not stating universals. They may sound like they’re universal, but even the psalmist knew they aren’t universal. David certainly knew. That righteous men suffer. He suffered a great deal himself as a righteous man. So when these kinds of things are said, they’re not universal. They’re basically saying when things do happen bad, it’s not because there’s no God. It’s not because, you know, God isn’t in control. Because God does when he wants to. He does protect you from all harm. And the only time you’ll suffer any harm is if God sees a good reason for your benefit and for his purposes. to allow some kind of harm to come into your life temporarily. So that’s how I take those passages. That’s a difficult question for many people, so I appreciate your question.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah, well, it does sound like something someone might claim as a promise very easily.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, the Bible never tells anyone to claim any promises. That’s something that certain Christians say, we need to claim the promises. Where? Where does it say claim the promises? The promises of God are not some kind of guarantees that we can, you know, activate supernaturally whenever we want to change our circumstances. The promises of God are there to tell us that this is God’s intention. This is what God has for us. And most of the promises are not really that specific. But there is a promise that, you know, God will provide all your needs. Well, and take that one. God will provide all your needs, the Bible says, several times, many times. And Jesus said, you shouldn’t worry about your needs because, you know, God feeds the sparrows, you know. Yeah. So you say, okay, well, yeah. He said, you’re worth more than sparrows, and if God feeds the sparrows, he’ll certainly feed you. Great, then I’ll never starve to death. Well, unless, of course, that’s the way that God intends for you to go because you’re You’re going to die some way. You might die of disease. You might die of criminal violence. You might die in a war. You might die in an accident. Or you might die of starvation. Probably not. In America, you won’t. But that’s one way of many that people die. And when he says, God feeds the sparrows so he’ll feed you, well, he does feed the sparrows, but they die too. But the point Jesus makes, he says, not one of them dies, not one of them falls to the ground apart from the will of your Father. Now, see… to a Christian that’s comforting because a Christian has already given up their own will and said, all I really want is the will of my Father. That’s what makes me a Christian as opposed to whatever I was before I was a Christian. Being a Christian means it’s no longer I but Christ. It’s no longer my will but God’s will. And if he wants me dead, that’s exactly what I want to be. Who would want to live a moment longer? then God has use for you to be here. And he won’t let you die as long as he has more use for you here. So the whole idea is we can surrender peacefully and confidently to God. He takes care of everything as long as it needs to be taken care of. But, you know, if I say, well, the angels are around me, so nothing can hurt me. I can’t die in an automobile accident. Well, unless God wants me to die that way. You know, the promises of God are, we can say, God takes care of all these things until it’s time for him not to. And that time is when it’s time for you to die, which there is a time like that for every human being. And so we just yield ourselves to the will of God. It says in 1 Peter 4, 19, Therefore, let those who suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in doing good as unto a faithful creator. So he says you’re suffering faithfully. Because you’re obedient to God. Well, if you’re suffering, it means he hasn’t protected you from some suffering that has come upon you. But you’re obedient to him. He says, well, then commit the keeping of your soul to him. That’s what Jesus did on the cross. Father, into your hands I commit my spirit. That’s what we’re supposed to do if we’re suffering. We just commit it to God. Well, what happened when Jesus committed himself to God? He died. He said, Father, into your hands I commit my spirit. He died. But God took care of things. He came back. You know, I mean, there’s always the righteous will be vindicated, but not always in this life. So this is much more complicated than some of these rather simplistic sounding statements. But the psalmist knew that, too. They’re writing poetry. And, you know, their statements are true insofar as they mean to be true. But they were not naive. I mean, none of the biblical writers… we’re completely protected from harm by God, and yet they recognize that God does and can protect you from any harm he wants to. And that’s a comfort to those who are willing to suffer harm if it’s the Father’s will, because we know the Father will never let us suffer for no good reason. And that’s simply the faith that a Christian has.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 02 :
All right. Well, I appreciate your call, Sister. Let’s take another call. We’re going to talk to Kevin in River Rouge, Michigan. Hi, Kevin. Good to hear from you again.
SPEAKER 11 :
Well, you see, that was one of the best dissertations I’ve heard in a long time regarding God’s will for a believer or a non-believer regarding the good, bad, and performance and God’s response. I’ll get to my questions right along those same lines as that, sister. I’d Like you, I’ve been a musician for a long time, since I was 13. And as such, now as a Christian, I’ve been for a while. I play some Christian, definitely Keith Green, probably a half dozen songs. So what’s your question? My question is, I’m hurting right now financially with bills. And I have a friend whose son plays up at a local… sitting here on the Detroit River. It’s a club that serves alcohol. I was wondering what you thought of me working out through Songs by America and, you know, just going up there and auditioning, see if I could get some work up there to help what it means.
SPEAKER 02 :
As far as I recall, America’s songs were fairly innocent. compared to some of the rock and roll of that time. The Bible doesn’t say you can’t listen to or play secular music, although you should only do it if the ultimate goal is the glory of God. How could playing secular music, how could your goal be to glorify God? Well, I mean… It may be your job. I think whatever job you have, you should do to the glory of God. You could be a witness anywhere you are. Now you say, but this is in a club and they sell alcohol. Yeah, they’ll probably do that even if you’re not there. If you don’t show up, they’ll probably still be selling alcohol. Almost everybody who works for a job or a corporation, unless it’s a Christian establishment, You know, there’s people there, customers and people who you work with who do bad things, things that you wouldn’t allow yourself to do. But that doesn’t mean you have to dissociate completely from them. Now, if you find yourself being drawn away from holiness and drawn away from sin, I mean into sin through being there, well, then I would say give it up. Give it up. Because Jesus said, if your hand or your eye causes you to sin, cut it off. Get rid of it, you know. So I’d say, you know, you might go there and say, well, I’m feeling tempted. I almost feel like I’m going to fall to getting drunk here or some other kind of worldliness. Well, then I’d say, you know, don’t do it. But this is how I pay my bills. I would say, well, cut it off, you know. Cut it off if it’s going to make you sin. It’s better that your bills not go paid or that you at least trust God to pay them some other way. So I don’t, you know, a lot of people won’t agree with me, but I think they’re just wrong. I think that Christians are not forbidden to work in secular places and to play secular music if it’s not, you know, if it’s not a temptation to people. I mean, there certainly is evil secular music that a Christian should not play. But in my opinion, I don’t think if you’re playing the kind of music you mentioned, I don’t think it’s going to be hurtful. It’s like, I mean, what if you were playing in a big band? with trumpets and all that kind of stuff, but there’s no singing, just singing old swing tunes or whatever. Well, I mean, there’s no words in those, but is that secular? Well, it’s not specifically Christian, but there is music that leads people to temptation and corrupts people, and there’s music that does not. So I would, as a Christian, now, by the way, I’ve never been in a band playing secular music, But if I felt like that was an opening God was giving me, I wouldn’t feel like, oh, I can’t do that. I’m a Christian. I can’t play those songs. Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there’s liberty. But just make sure that wherever you are, you’re walking in the Spirit of the Lord. Okay, I appreciate your call, Kevin. I hope God provides for you that way or some other way, whatever way is best. God knows. Let’s talk to Phillip from Oakley, California. Phillip, welcome to The Narrow Path.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, how you doing, Steven? My question may seem a little bit silly. I heard a preacher say you can only be baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, and if you haven’t been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, you’re not saved. And he doesn’t believe in women preachers. He doesn’t believe that a woman, he said if you’ve been baptized by a woman, even in the name of the Lord Jesus, you didn’t get saved. You have to get rebaptized by a man.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I actually don’t think that’s silly, but I don’t fully agree with all of that. It’s not silly because people could have their interpretation of Scripture could lead them that way. Certainly, for example, the Bible does say that women should not be overseers in the church, should not be the elders in the church. And yet the Bible doesn’t say that baptism has to be done by people who qualify as elders because it’s not. I know in our churches the pastor does the baptizing usually, but the Bible doesn’t say the person who does it has to be a pastor. I mean, Saul of Tarsus, who became the Apostle Paul, was baptized by someone who is in no sense identified as a church leader anywhere. He was just a brother. He was just a Christian in Damascus that was close to the Lord. And the Lord spoke to him and said, hey, you need to go lay hands on Saul and baptize him. So he did. There’s no suggestion made that he was a leader in the church in Damascus or anything like that. You know, Philip had been only ordained to be a deacon, which was to distribute food to the poor in the Jerusalem church. But when persecution broke out at the church, he fled like lots of other people did and found himself incapable of not talking about Jesus. So he talked about Jesus and people got saved and he baptized them. Now, he wasn’t a pastor. He wasn’t an apostle. He was just a Christian servant in the church. And so there’s nothing that says that the person who baptizes has to be a church leader. Now, I personally think it’s great if they are, because people are being baptized into the body of Christ. They’re not necessarily being baptized into a particular local church, because they might You might baptize someone into the body of Christ, and they might go to a church you’ve never visited. It’s not necessary that somebody is part of a particular church and is baptized into that church. We’re baptized into Christ, not into Paul or Barnabas or Cephas, Paul said in 1 Corinthians 1. So, you know, a woman, I think, is, as the Bible says, not to be an overseer, which would be comparable to a pastor today. And therefore, you know, I don’t think churches should have female pastors. But if they do, it doesn’t really have any impact on whether they can baptize or not, because even a woman who’s not a pastor could baptize somebody if they’re the only ones there to do it. Now, I do think that leadership in the church is supposed to be, when possible, conducted by the men of the church. And Jesus, I mean, Paul seemed to express that sentiment. And Jesus seemed to have that sentiment, too, because when he chose 12 leaders, if he was completely gender blind and didn’t care whether they were men or women or not, there’s some chance that some of them would be women. But when you choose 12 and they’re all men, even though there’s quite a few women around available to do that, it would seem that it’s deliberate. The choice of men was deliberate on the part of Jesus, and of course Paul said he didn’t put women in oversight. So my thought is that a woman could certainly baptize someone if she was the only person available, but I think that it is desirable to maintain the principle of male leadership in the church, which both Jesus and Paul observed. But I don’t know anywhere that says it’s sinful, you know, to not do so. I mean, having a woman pastor is not okay, according to Paul. But a woman who’s not a pastor, you know, would not be forbidden from baptizing. Now, if they say you have to be baptized in the name of Jesus, and by that they mean it’s not okay to be baptized in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, this is the view of what they call Jesus-onlys or oneness Pentecostals. They’re generally not Trinitarians. They don’t believe in the Trinity, and they believe that you should be baptized only in the name of Jesus, which is why they’re sometimes called Jesus-onlys. I believe they’re making mountains out of molehills. Jesus did say, baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. And the apostles in the book of Acts, baptize in the name of Jesus. So, you know, did they disobey Jesus? Or did they obey Jesus as they understood his meaning? Apparently, they understood his meaning to be baptizing in the name of Jesus is the same as baptizing in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. And that the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is the name of Jesus. So when Jesus said, baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and then they went out and baptized in the name of Jesus, it seems like that’s how they understood it. Which means, unless I’m mistaken, as I sometimes have been, but I’m not sure how I could be found mistaken on this point, that they seem to have thought the name of Jesus was synonymous with the name of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit. And if it was, then there’s no reason why one formula would be preferred over the other, if they mean the same thing. If Jesus, I mean, in my opinion, they could say, I baptize you in the name of the Messiah. I baptize you in the name of the Alpha and the Omega. I baptize you in the name of the Prince of Peace. And they’d all be the same person they’re talking about. So they’re still baptizing in the name of Jesus unless they’re identifying the Prince of Peace and the Messiah as someone other than Jesus. In other words, I don’t believe that we have to follow legalistically some ritualistic formula. I think the point is people are being baptized into Christ, and he’s known by many names, so I would not be legalistic about whether this specific term was used because actually in the book of Acts, Though they always baptized in the name of Christ, they didn’t always use the same formula. Sometimes they baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Sometimes in the name of Jesus Christ. And so forth. I mean, obviously, it’s the same person. Different way of saying it. So, some people are more legalistic on this matter than I think they should be. And I think they’re more legalistic than God is on it. Anyway, we could have that debate sometime, but we’re out of time. You’re listening to the Narrow Path radio broadcast. My name is Steve Gregg, and we are live Monday through Friday. doing just this thing, and we’ve been doing this for 28 or going on now 29 years daily. We are listener-supported. We pay for the time on the radio stations. It’s a lot of money. 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