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In this episode of Washington Watch, guest host Jody Heiss takes us through the crucial developments in the nation’s capital, including the historic end of the longest government shutdown. Senate Majority Leader John Thune addresses the Senate floor amidst the anticipation of the House reconvening after a prolonged break. From the intricacies of government logistics to the emotional impact on the American public, this discussion sets the stage for what’s to follow as U.S. leaders return to tackle looming legislative challenges.
SPEAKER 01 :
from the heart of our nation’s capital in Washington, D.C., bringing compelling interviews, insightful analysis, taking you beyond the headlines and soundbites into conversations with our nation’s leaders and newsmakers, all from a biblical worldview. Sitting in for Tony is today’s host, Jody Heiss.
SPEAKER 05 :
This has been a very long road, quite literally the longest shutdown in history. I am very, very happy to be able to say that we are coming to the end.
SPEAKER 04 :
That was Senate Majority Leader John Thune on the Senate floor bringing an end to this long, long government shutdown. Welcome to this Veterans Day edition of Washington Watch. Hope you’ve had a fantastic day and an opportunity to express gratitude for those who keep us all safe and keep our liberties intact. All right, we’ve got several things coming up today, and it’s my honor to be sitting in for Tony Perkins today. Thank you so much for joining us. All right, as we’ve mentioned, lawmakers are making their way back to Washington, D.C., and this is in the midst of what the Senate voted on last night, 60 to 40. Now the ball is in the court of the House of Representatives. They’re on their way back to vote on that, Congressman Andy Harris. will be joining me here in just a few moments to give us the latest on that. And on the international front, perhaps you didn’t know it. I didn’t know it at the time myself, but Turkey’s foreign minister actually joined the talks yesterday between President Trump and Syria’s new leader. We will get the latest on all of that and what potentially this could mean to Christians and minorities in the region. Congressman Keith Self will be joining us for that discussion. All right, as I mentioned, the members of the House of Representatives now are making their way back to Washington, D.C. after having a 53-day break that they all took. They’re trying to manage their way through a tangled mess at airports all across the country with cancellations. and delays, but they are making their way back after the Senate voted, as I mentioned, on a 60 to 40 vote to end the government shutdown. And joining me now is Washington Stand reporter Casey Harper. Casey, all right, let’s get started, first of all, with what’s happening in airports all across the country. How is this going to impact the return of the members of the House of Representatives?
SPEAKER 17 :
Yeah, thanks, Jody. It’s a good question because there have been nearly 1,300 flights that were canceled just today. That’s not counting the delays we’ve seen leading up to today. And that’s all because of the shutdown, air traffic controllers not able to come to work. Because of that, many lawmakers are actually carpooling to the Capitol, which is kind of amazing. That includes Republican representatives like Rick Crawford of Arkansas and Trent Kelly of Mississippi. And get this one, Jody, Representative Derek Van Orden said he was making the 16-hour drive from Wisconsin to D.C. on his motorcycle.
SPEAKER 08 :
Hey, everybody, it’s Congressman Derek Van Orden. Let’s get a little gas, and then I’m going to ride through Chicago at night on a motorcycle wearing a Green Bay Packers hoodie. So if I don’t get ahold of you in a little bit, call the Coast Guard, will you? Thanks.
SPEAKER 17 :
That’s a great clip. But the House is expected to vote tomorrow afternoon on this compromise measure that would restore funding to government agencies and end the shutdown, which is now on its 42nd day. The deal passed by the Senate would extend funding all the way through January 30th, Jody.
SPEAKER 04 :
Wow, I love motorcycles, but I cannot imagine this time of year. That’s a long, cold trip. 16 hours. Oh my goodness, it is. Well, Casey, listen, you mentioned it, I did as well, but happy Veterans Day to you. I know there were a lot of activities taking place in Washington. What did President Trump do today?
SPEAKER 17 :
Well, earlier today, President Trump honored our veterans with a wreath-laying ceremony at Arlington National Cemetery and expressed his gratitude to our troops and our veterans.
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Today we remember with overwhelming gratitude the more than one million American service members who have made the supreme sacrifice and laid down their lives for the good old USA. Generation after generation, America’s warriors have left behind the comforts of home and family to face violence, evil, and death so that our families could know joy, goodness, and peace. We honor them so strongly. Our heroes have lived through unthinkable nightmares so we could live the American Dream. And the American Dream is coming back again. stronger than ever before.
SPEAKER 17 :
In that speech, President Trump went on to congratulate Speaker of the House Mike Johnson, who was present at the ceremony, for what he called a Republican victory in the government shutdown standoff. And now Trump’s support means he will almost certainly sign the bill when it does eventually, hopefully, land on his desk, Jody.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, a lot of gratitude to be expressed for sure all around. Casey, if we can turn to some international news. There are reports, and I was not aware of this yesterday, that Turkey was actually involved in the talks between President Trump and Syria’s president at the White House yesterday. What’s the latest on that?
SPEAKER 17 :
Yeah, Jody, I think Turkey’s involvement, not just in that meeting, but overall has been a surprise to a lot of people. But Turkey’s foreign minister, Hakan Fidan, met with top U.S. officials in Washington, including Secretary of State Marco Rubio and Vice President J.D. Vance. Now, they met to discuss developments in Syria and Gaza. Fedan also joined the meeting, as you mentioned, between President Trump and Syria’s terrorist-turned-president, Ahmed al-Sharah, who is a former al-Qaeda commander now trying to present himself as a moderate after toppling the brutal regime of Syria’s previous president, Bashar al-Assad. Now, after the meeting, President Trump called al-Sharah a strong leader and said the U.S. wants to help Syria become a stable and successful part of the Middle East. He also suggested that discussions on a potential security agreement between Syria and Israel may be underway, which would be a big development. But with Erdogan’s authoritarian tendencies and bad track record in Turkey, along with al-Sharah’s past as an al-Qaeda commander, there’s plenty of concern to go around about the fate of Christians in both of those countries, Jody.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yes. And speaking of that, before I let you go, there are reports now coming out of Sudan that are indicating some pretty serious threats in Christian communities there. What are you hearing on that front?
SPEAKER 17 :
Yeah, I’m glad you brought that up, Jody. It’s pretty amazing and terrible what’s happening there. The United Nations actually said just today that women fleeing Sudan’s Al-Fashir region They’re seeing killings, rape, and even their children being abducted by the rapid support forces there. So UN officials are warning that sexual violence is being used systematically as a weapon of that war, which means around 11 million women and girls in Darfur face going hungry. And to go and forage for food, they have to risk being attacked. Now, amid this chaos, the South Sudanese Christians in Khartoum are also facing growing fear. The church services there become risky after arrests, including the arrest of Pastor Peter Perpigny, which happened during a funeral, believe it or not. But now, many Christians avoid gathering or even leaving home, fearing some kind of arbitrary arrest and detention. Which is no surprise, Jody, that Sudan is ranked number five on Opendoor’s World Watch list for extreme Christian persecution.
SPEAKER 04 :
Wow. All right, Casey, thank you so much for giving us the highlights. We appreciate it very much. I don’t want to go now to a deeper dive into the number one item of the day, which is the government shutdown. Let’s get a report from Capitol Hill. Joining me now to discuss this is Congressman Andy Harris. He serves as the chairman of the House Freedom Caucus, and he’s also a member of the Appropriations Committee. He represents the 1st Congressional District of Maryland. Dr. Harris, welcome back to Washington Watch. Always an honor to have you.
SPEAKER 07 :
Good to be with you, Jody.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, let me begin, first of all, by saying happy Veterans Day to you. I know you served for, I believe, 17 years. Thank you so much for your service.
SPEAKER 07 :
No, it was my honor to serve the country.
SPEAKER 04 :
And you are still doing so. Listen, let me first get your thoughts on all that’s unfolded the last couple of days as it relates to the shutdown and potentially the end of it all right now.
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, Jody, it’s a shame that it took 42 days. The bottom line is the same deal could have been made on day one or even on September 30th. And it was turned down by the Democrats. Fifteen votes in the Senate to to keep the shutdown going. Finally, a handful of Democrats came to the realization that no one was being benefited by this. You know, 40 million people on snap weren’t getting their benefits. Millions of people. who want to travel by air were being harmed. Again, our troops threatened with not getting paid. And they came to their senses and joined the Republicans who never wanted to shut it down, who voted multiple times to reopen the government and the Senate. So thank goodness it’s over. Again, we’ll come to Washington tomorrow. The House will be in. They’ll pass the rule tonight to debate it tomorrow. And we’ll pass it tomorrow night. President will sign it. And hopefully by Thursday, this nightmare caused by Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries will be over.
SPEAKER 04 :
Wow. We all certainly hope so. You know, one thing that really interested me and one reason I was wanting to have you and thank you for coming on this evening was after the whole deal broke in the Senate, you were right away. in favor of it with one caveat. And that was you were trying to push back on Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky, who is putting forward a measure involving intoxicating hemp provisions. That was a big deal. And I appreciated you highlighting that immediately. But explain that to us real quickly and why that would have been a deal breaker for you.
SPEAKER 07 :
So, Jody, what happened in the 2018 Farm Bill is we legalized the growing of hemp, which is, of course, related to marijuana. But you can grow a hemp product that has very low amount of intoxicant and use it for industrial purposes, to make cloth, to make flooring, to industrial purposes. But because we didn’t limit it specifically, what I’ll say the bad actors were doing is using a loophole and taking hemp extracting the intoxicants, the THC, synthesizing it, resynthesizing to other things like Delta-8, and then selling it literally in gas stations and vape shops to children even that had intoxicating levels of THC, which is the same intoxicants you have in marijuana. So they were exploiting a loophole. They were poisoning our children. We had to close the loophole. And fortunately, the bill that we’re going to pass tomorrow closes that loophole.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yes, that was a fortunate thing. And thank you so much for highlighting that. I thought that was a great, great catch. And for you to not only catch it, but to make it a public issue was huge. All right, Dr. Harris, how do you see the rest of the week unfolding? What’s this going to look like? Members are coming back. You really think they’ll be back with all the cancellations and delays? You think you will be able indeed to vote on this tomorrow?
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah, and you know, the Speaker called the Republicans back in a call Monday morning, so hopefully they’ll have two days to find those flights, make sure they get the flights like Derek Van Orden, you know, God bless him, makes it here on his motorcycle. But I think we’re going to have everybody in town, and I think there will be a handful of Democrats who, like the handful of Democrats in the Senate, realize they shouldn’t put the nation through this. So I think that we’re going to have a pretty smooth sailing to pass this bill tomorrow they’re not going to allow any amendments because then it would have to go over to the senate and you know again this shutdown has lasted long enough you know the house which took action eight weeks ago is going to take the final action tomorrow to end this shutdown uh less than a minute ago do you think any democrats will come on board with it in the house Oh, there will definitely be some Democrats. The question is the number. I suspect it’ll be between 10 and 20. Hakeem Jeffries, for some reason, wants to keep punishing the nation by keeping the government shut down to protect the 7% of Americans who are getting a COVID-era Obamacare premium enhancements, subsidy enhancements. When 100% of Americans need relief from health care premiums, they only want to help 7% and keep the government shut down to do that. It’s ridiculous.
SPEAKER 04 :
Wow. Marilyn, Congressman Andy Harris, Chairman of the Freedom Caucus, again, thank you so much for your service to this country, both in the military and now in Congress. We appreciate you joining us on Washington Watch as well.
SPEAKER 07 :
Thank you, Jody. God bless you.
SPEAKER 04 :
All right, friends, coming up, we’re going to get another congressional perspective, this time on the meeting between President Trump and Syria’s president. Yesterday, Congressman Keith Self will be with me right after the break. So stay tuned. We’ll be back.
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For over 4,000 years, the Jewish people have had legal, historical, and biblical ties to the land of Israel, especially the heartland of Israel, Judea and Samaria, which much of the world still calls the West Bank. To Israelis, Judea and Samaria is far more than a name. It’s the center of their ancestral homeland where nearly 80% of the Bible’s events took place. Abraham purchased property in Hebron, Jacob in Shechem, Joshua made an altar on Mount Ebal and led the Israelites into a covenant before God. On Mount Gerizim, overlooking Shechem, Jesus talked to the Samaritan woman at the well about worshiping neither on Mount Gerizim nor in Jerusalem, but in spirit and in truth. Judea and Samaria is nearly a quarter of Israel’s current land mass, not a small strip of land on the Jordan River, but a vital and strategic part of the nation’s identity. The October 7th massacre, launched from Gaza, shattered the illusion that giving away territory brings peace. Gaza, which was once seen as the cornerstone of a two-state solution, became a launch pad for terror. Today, only 21% of Israelis support a Palestinian state. Trust in a two-state solution has all but collapsed. The Middle East is changing. Iran’s grip is weakening. New alliances are forming. But Western countries and some US officials still chase the mirage of a two-state solution. History speaks clearly. The 2005 Gaza withdrawal, backed by the US, led not to peace, but to a terrorist regime. Judea and Samaria are 24 times larger than Gaza, deeply woven into Israel’s geographic and spiritual fabric. To surrender them would not bring peace. It would invite conflict and existential danger. Family Research Council stands with Israel’s rightful claim to sovereignty. It’s time for America to do the same for history, for justice, and for lasting security in the Middle East.
SPEAKER 04 :
Good afternoon. Happy Veterans Day to you. Welcome back to Washington Watch. I’m Jody Heiss filling in today for Tony Perkins, and thank you so much for joining us. All right, yesterday, President Trump spoke to reporters about his White House meeting with the new president of Syria, Ahmad al-Sharaa. And keep in mind, this is a former terrorist who is now president. Well, that meeting at the White House was the first ever meeting It was the first ever of this type, and President Trump thinks that al-Sharah can actually make a difference there. Let’s continue with that clip.
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He’s a very strong leader. He comes from a very tough place, and he’s a tough guy. I like him. I get along with him. The president, the new president of Syria, and we’ll do everything we can to make Syria successful because that’s part of the Middle East. We want to see Syria become… a country that’s very successful. And I think this leader can do it. I really do. I think this leader can do it.
SPEAKER 04 :
Wow, powerful comments indeed. So what would success in Syria actually look like? And even going beyond that, what would be the role of the United States in seeing that come to reality? Well, joining me now to discuss this and more is Congressman Keith Self. He serves on several committees, including the House Foreign Affairs Committee, where he chairs the subcommittee on Europe. He also served our country faithfully for 25 years in the Army. before retiring with the rank of Lieutenant Colonel. He represents the 3rd Congressional District of Texas. Congressman Self, welcome back to Washington Watch. Always great to have you, and happy Veterans Day to you. Thank you so much for your service. Thank you, Jody. Great to be here with you, particularly on this day. On this special day, indeed. All right, so let’s begin with the meeting that took place with Al Sharai at the White House yesterday. Your thoughts?
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, President Trump is making gargantuan efforts to bring peace to the Middle East. But I want to let our viewers know who this al-Shara is. His former name was al-Jalani. He fought American forces in Iraq for three years. We had him in prison for five years. Then he went to Syria, and he now is the president of Syria. I would caution people that taqiyya is a concept in Sharia, in Islam, that allows them to lie to us until they can strengthen their position. I want Syria to be successful. But right now, we have minority religions that are being killed, that are being persecuted inside Syria, and he’s doing nothing about it.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, and that’s the big concern for many of us. I understand that that topic at least came up yesterday. Do you have any idea how far that conversation went with the new Syrian leader, or do you think that this is just the meeting yesterday was the beginning of more talks to come, and hopefully that issue of persecuted minorities being addressed?
SPEAKER 12 :
I think it will have to be addressed in future meetings. At the first meeting, you don’t have that depth of a conversation. But I trust that the administration will continue to have that conversation, to get deeper into it, and to make very clear that Americans will stand with persecuted minorities, particularly the Christians, the Druze, and even the Alawites, understanding that Assad was an Alawite. So we need to stand with the persecuted minorities.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, President al-Sharah did say in an interview with Fox News that Syria would not at this time enter into talks to join the Abraham Accords. But the reason being, he cited the so-called occupation of Israel in the Golan Heights. So be that whatever it may be from his perspective. But he did float the possibility of future talks with the help of President Trump and his administration. So as you just mentioned, some of these conversations don’t go to the end game right away. They’re future talks. And at least in this regard, he said he’s open to future talks. What’s your thoughts on that?
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, he would have to say that because he wants the US to support him in Syria. He wants to be successful. He wants the US to support him. So he will say that. Our job is to trust but verify, to use an old Reagan term. Because I am not convinced that he is the moderate Muslim that he says he is. Because again, Sharia demands that both Muslims and non-Muslims submit. So let’s see how it is going forward. Trust, but verify.
SPEAKER 04 :
Okay, so that leads me to the moving forward with extending the lifting of sanctions for another 180 days. What’s your thoughts? Is that an appropriate way for us to enter into this discussion right now, do you think?
SPEAKER 12 :
I don’t like that because of his stance on Israel. Now, you’ve got to understand, his family comes from the Golan Heights, part of his family. So when he mentioned the Golan Heights, it immediately perked up my ears because he holds Israel, obviously, as the cause of the trouble in the Middle East. I don’t think that there’s any argument there. And because he does, I think we ought to proceed very cautiously. We need to demand steps from them before we start offering steps to them. So I’m not convinced that we’re there to lift sanctions. That is a serious issue when you lift sanctions. And I’m not sure this is the guy I’m going to trust to lift U.S. sanctions on him.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, it’s going to be very, very interesting. But again, if anybody’s going to be doing this, I’m sure President Trump is the one for it. Real quickly, we’ve got only about a little over a minute here. The Turkey representative was in the meeting yesterday. I wanted your real quick thoughts on that. And then you’ve got a bill that was introduced last month to help extend religious rights to veterans. Speak on that real quickly, too.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, real quickly, Turkey. Turkey, I am very concerned that Turkey and Israel may go to conflict. So Turkey being in this meeting with Syria, I don’t think is a good sign because Israel will defend southern Syria because that’s on their border. So let’s leave it at that. I don’t like Turkey being in this meeting. I have concerns about Turkey being a NATO ally and in the Middle East. Now, to my bill, if a veteran wants to be referred to a faith-based organization, this gives VA, if he wants it, the authority to do that for the veteran. The veteran is in charge.
SPEAKER 04 :
Wow. Thank you so much, Texas Congressman Keith Self. Always an honor to have you again. Thank you for your service. Thank you. Happy Veterans Day to you. And thank you so much for joining us on Washington Watch today. Thank you, Jody. All right. Coming up, there’s some disturbing developments coming out of Sudan where some unimaginable atrocities are taking place. Former Congressman Frank Wolf will be joining me to unpack what’s going on there. So stay tuned.
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Three years ago, the Supreme Court issued its historic Dobbs decision, a ruling that overturned Roe versus Wade, which for nearly 50 years imposed abortion on demand, silencing voters and bypassing the democratic process across the country. The Dobbs decision was a huge step forward against abortion, but it didn’t outright ban it. It returned the power to the people. Now, 29 states have laws on the books protecting life. However, there’s a catch. Abortion numbers since Dobbs have actually gone up with an increase of 12% since 2020, climbing from 930,000 to over 1 million in each of the most recent years. So how can this be? The answer is simple, the abortion drug. Today, over 60% of US abortions involve abortion drugs, many of these without medical oversight. In 2021, the Biden administration quietly removed bare minimum longstanding safety protocols for the abortion drug that have existed for 20 years to protect women from life-threatening risks and ensuring informed consent. The Biden DOJ then declared that they would not enforce the Comstock Act, which prevents the mailing of anything that causes an abortion. This is not only illegal, but also dangerous. A study shows nearly 11% of women who take the abortion drug end up in the emergency room with serious complications. Unless the Trump administration reverses these reckless Biden-era policies, pro-life laws will remain largely symbolic. Without a full review and repeal of Mifepristone, unborn lives will remain in grave danger, and pregnant mothers will remain at risk. Let’s stand for life and end this mail-order abortion drug pipeline. Sign the petition urging the Trump administration to take action at frc.org slash stop chemical abortion.
SPEAKER 04 :
Welcome back to Washington Watch. I’m Jody Heiss filling in today for Tony Perkins. Thank you so much for tuning in as well. All right. While so much of the world’s attention over the past couple of years has been on the wars in Gaza and Ukraine, a more severe crisis has been overlooked by many with massacres, quite frankly, just as horrifying as the October 7th terrorist attack against Israel. And even with a death toll now of some 150,000, maybe even more than that, I’m talking about the civil war in Sudan. It started in April two years ago, and it’s getting worse and worse with aid operations in Sudan reportedly on the brink of collapse. with unimaginable atrocities taking place. In fact, the carnage in one Sudanese city has become so severe that bloodstains can be seen from space. It’s just unbelievable what’s taking place, and the fact that hardly any reporting has been on this is just unthinkable. So what is happening, and what can be done about all this? Well, joining me now to discuss this is former Virginia Congressman Frank Wolf, who founded and co-authored the Tom Lantos Human Rights Commission. He also authored the 1998 report, United States International Religious Freedom Act. He also led the first congressional delegation to Darfur in Western Sudan. Frank, welcome back to Washington Watch. Happy Veterans Day to you.
SPEAKER 14 :
Thank you, Jody. It’s good to be with you. Thank you very much.
SPEAKER 04 :
It was good to see you again. Listen, you have done so much, and I do want to get to solutions in all of this, but let’s start, if you would, Frank, give us just kind of a brief overview, if you will, of the situation in Sudan, both historically and currently. What’s happening?
SPEAKER 14 :
It’s horrible. It’s so horrible that it’s… The best word would be, it is genocide. It literally meets the definition of genocide. There’s massive killing. There’s rape. There’s starvation. Your stories are coming about mothers having to decide what child they want to see to live. So it’s about horrible as you can possibly be. Both sides are bad. Sudan… Military army is very, very bad. But the RSF, which is originated in Darfur, in what they call the genocide, if you remember 2004, are even worse. So the genocide… is beyond imagination. Some of the people who were actually committing the genocide are actually taking pictures of what they’re doing. As you mentioned at the outset, Congressman Senator Brownback and I were there with my chief of staff, Dan Scanlon. In 2004, what we saw then was terrible. Now, what’s taking place now is much, much worse. And we came back and we called Secretary Powell, Colin Powell, and said, designate this As genocide, this is unbelievable. To the credit of Colin Powell, Secretary Powell, he did. Now the condition is so much worse. I mean, death and destruction. And you don’t hear very much about it. The only people covering, Wall Street Journal covers it a little bit. New York Times covers it a little bit. Once in a while, The Washington Post. But it’s a very dangerous place. So for the reporters to go, they are basically risking their lives.
SPEAKER 04 :
So what can be done about this? Let’s get to some solutions. You’ve been there. You see it. You have a good understanding. Are there some specific steps that can be done to help remedy this problem?
SPEAKER 14 :
Yes, yes, there are. One, it has to be called genocide. Our government has to designate this as genocide. So anybody knows that they’re putting any weapons in, doing anything, they’re basically going to be complicit in the genocide. So number one, it must be called genocide. Number two… We need to appoint a special envoy. If you recall, we had Senator Danforth in 2004, a special envoy who’s really tough. Maybe even a retired military general, if you recall, AFRICOM, which controls our military in Africa. Somebody like that is really tough because both of these guys are generals. So call genocide, designate a special envoy, and then begin to send messages. For instance, The UAE has a number of retired American military officers that are working for the UAE. They’re not involved in genocide. Don’t get me wrong. But to helping them on weapons and arms and things like that, they should be told they have to come home. They cannot go there without the approval of the Defense Department. They should be told they have to come home until the UAE stops aiding and sending weapons to the RSF. So that is clear. Also, Saudi Arabia is giving. We’re supposed to have a great relationship. Saudi Arabia is helping the other side. Egypt is helping the other side. Turkey, your previous person just talked about Turkey. Turkey is involved. And the fighting has gone on for two years. The numbers of deaths are in the hundreds. I mean, people exaggerate. I see it 150,000, some say 400,000, but it’s thousands upon thousands upon thousands. Next, those military officers are told they cannot work for the UAE while the UAE is sending weapons to the RSF to kill people and literally do terrible, terrible things, which we won’t get into. Next, the NBA is there. The National Basketball Association is there. They have tournaments there. They should be told no tournaments, no tournaments in the UAE. Why? The UAE is doing what they’re doing. They’re sending weapons into the RSF. The RSF is about a bad of a group that you’re ever going to have. I mean, if they get any worse, I don’t know where it would be. It would be in hell. And they should be told, no, you can’t. NBA, they have tournaments there. The NBA should not be.
SPEAKER 04 :
We’re going to have to wrap it up right there. Former Congressman Virginia from Virginia, Frank Wolf, so great to see you again. Outstanding information. I hope your voice is heard. You’re looking great, my friend. Happy Veterans Day to you. God bless you. All right, coming up next, the U.S. Supreme Court’s decision yesterday not to hear a case that some were hoping would overturn Oberfeld. Stay with us. We’ll get into it next.
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Our founding scripture for this is Ephesians chapter 6, verse 13. Therefore… Take up the whole armor of God that you may be able to stand in the evil day. And having done all to stand, stand therefore.
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Family Research Council’s Pray, Vote, Stand Summit 2025 brought together Christian leaders, issue experts, and government officials for a time of prayer, inspiration, and action.
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We are equipping the body of Christ to understand that what is happening around us is not just political. It’s not just cultural. At its heart, it is spiritual.
SPEAKER 03 :
We gather in a nation that has torn the foundation apart, and we have separated our governing documents from our divine source, Jesus Christ. We need truth now more than ever to guide us.
SPEAKER 18 :
I’m believing, God, let this be a testimony of the American church, that we become so full of the fire of the Word of God that we cannot contain it. We have to tell people about it. We have to make disciples.
SPEAKER 20 :
The idea of America was the idea that our rights don’t come from governments. They come from our divine creator, right? Government’s main job is to protect those rights. And because that was the foundation of America, we’ve enjoyed over the last 250 years, more freedom, more prosperity, more stability than any other nation anywhere in the world. And that should be celebrated.
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We are living in a moment. What’s that moment? It’s a prophetic moment on God’s timeline. That’s right. And so he needs the church more than ever to act biblically for the blessing of our political leaders and of our nation.
SPEAKER 02 :
The number one issue facing America domestically, which is the epidemic of fatherlessness. 40% of all American children today enter the world without a father in the home married to the mother.
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We cannot win the pro-life fight without acknowledging that this is the pro-family fight, that this is the pro-marriage fight. We’re never going to end abortion if we do not secure and shore up marriage.
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We pray that this would be an opportunity, Lord God, for you to use us mere little mortals, but we possess the name of Jesus. God, use us mightily. We pray in Jesus’ name and all God’s people said, amen.
SPEAKER 23 :
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SPEAKER 04 :
Happy Veterans Day to you. Welcome back to Washington Watch. I’m Jody Heiss sitting in today for Tony and, of course, the website TonyPerkins.com. Or better yet, you can download the Stand Firm app. Folks, I’m telling you, if you don’t already have this app, I want to strongly encourage you to get the Stand Firm app right away. You obviously have their access to the Washington Watch, but also the Washington Stand, Stand on the Word, much, much more, all in one place. And in the midst of all of that enables you to connect with a community of believers who who are wanting to stay up to speed on news stories from a biblical perspective, people who want to engage the public square. So again, if you don’t already have StandFirm, it’s easy, easy to get. Simply text the word APP to 67742, and you’ll be glad you did it. I can promise you that. Okay, yesterday, the U.S. Supreme Court declined to hear the case of Kim Davis. Now, you may remember Kim Davis was a former Kentucky County clerk. She’s been fighting a decade-long court case over her stand for marriage and religious liberties. And some people had hoped that this would be the case that would lead to the overturning of the 2015 ruling that fabricated the right to so-called same-sex marriage. But obviously, that’s going to have to come at another day through another case. And many believe, though, that that day is absolutely going to come. Not a matter of when, or it’s not a matter of if, but a matter of when. And in fact, my next guest is one of those who believes that. Joining me now to share his thoughts on this is Matt Staver. He’s the founder and chairman of Liberty Council, which represented Kim Davis in this case. Matt, welcome back to Washington Watch.
SPEAKER 10 :
Thank you, Jody. Good to be with you as always.
SPEAKER 04 :
And likewise. So give me your overall reaction. I know you’ve been in the thick of this from the beginning, but your reaction to the Supreme Court’s decision not to hear your client’s case.
SPEAKER 10 :
Well, you know, Jody, it was very disappointing, heartbreaking, frankly, because it certainly is a heartbreaking situation for Kim Davis, who now faces $360,000 in a judgment against her personally, for just simply asking for a simple religious accommodation, that is to have her name removed from the licenses. She could not have put her name on a license that affirmed a marriage that God does not design between two people of the same sex. And frankly, she got the accommodation she requested. She got it in September, just about six weeks after the lawsuit began. Following six days that she served in jail, she got that first accommodation from the Democrat governor, who said, yeah, you could scratch through your name, and that’s OK. The license is still valid. She got it again in December of 2015 with the Republican governor, Matt Bevin, with an executive order. And then she got it by a unanimously passed law in April of 2016. So she got the accommodation. They got the license. But then it turned into a vendetta against her. So this case had really compelling facts. You have the first victim after Obergefell on June 26, 2015. She loses her liberty for six days. She gets the accommodation that she asked for. They get the license that they wanted, except it didn’t have her name. And that’s why they continued the litigation against her. And it’s a compelling case for their free exercise of religion, even if they didn’t want to overturn a burger fail yet, which I certainly think that they should. Three justices have really clearly stated their opinion that it was wrong, including the chief justice. They could have and should have addressed the free exercise of religion and helped this individual who got the accommodation that she so clearly deserves. So why the Supreme Court does not take a case, you never know because they don’t give an opinion. They just say they denied it. Now I know. There’s about 8,000 cases every year that are requested, and only about 1% are granted. Very small number. But this case really cried out for review. And a lot of people, like you say, were watching this case. So unfortunately for Kim Davis, this case has come to an end after 10 years. But I am one of those, very strongly, Jody, that believes it’s not a matter of if a burger fail will be overturned. It’s just a matter of when. So now we go into phase two. The first phase essentially was Kim Davis, and that was the big opportunity to overturn Bergerfeld. But the movement, the stand that Kim Davis took 10 years ago and through this 10 years of litigation, I think is going to raise up legislators, local, state politicians and governments and individuals to challenge Obergefell. And we are going to clearly work towards that end. We will not rest until Obergefell is overturned. Mark my word, it will be overturned because it has no basis in the Constitution.
SPEAKER 04 :
Absolutely. Matt, just thank you so much for standing in the gap in this case. You had mentioned some very serious financial and personal consequences for Kim. How can we be praying for her in this situation right now?
SPEAKER 10 :
Well, pray for Kim. She’s an amazing individual. I mean, she had her life radically transformed just a few years before she was elected to the clerk position. God prepared her. So she really focuses on following the Lord. She knows what she did was the right thing to do, and she is trusting the Lord for provision. So we’re going now into the phase of discovery regarding her finances. She, frankly, does not have that much. She’s in her retirement years. So you can’t get blood from a turnip. But that’s the next phase that we’re going in. Continue to pray for her and Joe, her husband, her family, children, her grandchildren. But she, you know, as I spoke to her yesterday, she had a bad feeling in her gut, she said, just before the opinion came out or the decision not to take the case. So she had sort of a premonition, if you will, that God just was preparing her for the fact that this case was ending. But she’s in good hands and she has an incredible, indomitable spirit because she trusts in the Lord. So thanks for praying for her. Continue to do so.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yes. Thank you, Matt Saver and all of you there at Liberty Council for the incredible work that you do, not only in this case, but so many others. And deeply appreciate you joining us today on Washington Watch. Thank you. My pleasure. I want to continue our discussion right now on the Supreme Court denial of the review and get another perspective on it. Joining me now is Katie Faust. She’s the founder and president of Them Before Us, which is a global movement defending children’s rights to their mother and father. Katie, welcome back to Washington Watch. Thank you for joining me.
SPEAKER 13 :
Great to be with you and what an honor and makes it easy for me to follow Matt Staver, who laid out the case of what Kim Davis was attempting to do and how she has been targeted maliciously by these men for her firm stance and her convictions. So, you know, what Matt said is that Obergefell needs to be overturned on constitutional grounds. I would say Obergefell needs to be overturned on the grounds that it victimizes children. And so I agree with both of you that this is not a matter of if, it’s a matter of when. And if I have my say, it’s going to be sooner rather than later.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, so let’s explore this. I read an article by you that was just fantastic as you were laying out this case that this was not the case to overturn Obergefell, but it’s going to move forward. And we’re going to, as Matt just said, I mean, he’s guaranteeing that day is going to come. I think you share that opinion as well. But explain why this was not the right case to see Obergefell overturned.
SPEAKER 13 :
Well, in my opinion, even though Kim Davis is a victim of gay marriage, but she’s not the primary victim of Obergefell. The primary victims of Obergefell are the children. It’s not really that she had to violate her conscience. That is too bad. And I’m glad that she has stood firm. And I wish to God that she got paid back the hundreds of thousands of dollars that those emotional children Those two men demanded of her. But she’s not the primary victim of gay marriage. What gay marriage did is it set in motion a process to strip children of their mother and father in law. And we have seen that over the last 10 years, that states and the federal government has in many ways stripped the words mothers and fathers out of their parenthood statutes. They have redefined infertility so that a single man, a single woman, two men, two women can have their IVF treatments, which would require a child lose their mother or father through that IVF treatment to be subsidized by their insurance companies or by the government in some cases. They’ve created new pathways for parenthood that don’t have to do with a biological connection or an adoption recognition. It’s simply acquiring a child through your intent to parent them. And so we’ve actually seen a huge overhaul of the law as a result of Obergefell. You know, we were promised that this was just about a personal relationship between two adults. You know, what two adults want to do in the privacy of their own bedroom. Or we just want to have the insurance benefits that the heterosexual couples get. Nope, that’s not what happened. The Supreme Court made husbands and wives optional in marriage. And as a result, mothers and fathers have become optional in parenthood laws. And when you look at that from the child’s perspective, that’s an injustice.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, let’s go down that path, because I think, at least for most people, when they think of Obergefell, they think of a redefinition of marriage. But what you are bringing to light right now is that this also, and really probably… at least every bit as important, maybe more so, is a redefinition of parenthood. So this decision was not just a redefinition of marriage, but a redefinition of parenthood. Unpack that for us just a little bit more. I think that’s a powerful point.
SPEAKER 13 :
What did Justice Kennedy say when he wrote his opinion on Obergefell? He said that same-sex couples should be afforded the same constellation of benefits as heterosexual couples. There can be no distinction between two men and a man and a woman when they get married. Now, the problem is that marriage is the center of marriage and family law. And when you swap out a procreative definition of marriage for a definition that validates the identity and the desires and the feelings of adults, what you’re going to do is require that children conform to that identity. And that’s exactly what happened in the past. You know, we had close to three dozen states that had defined marriage as between one man and one woman in their constitution or through a vote. And we had laws that exalted the natural family that said children need their own mother and father, or children do best when they’re raised by their married mother and father. How long has it been since you’ve heard a politician say that? It’s been about 10 years. Because what same-sex marriage did, in essence, it made stating and acting on that self-evident, critical belief that children need their own mother and father to thrive, it made it discriminatory. It made it unconstitutional. And so now the law has had to deliver, it has had to facilitate something that nature prohibits. which is making two men or two women the parents of a child. And so we have seen wars over birth certificates. We have seen the redefinition of infertility. We have seen the gender neutralizing of parenthood statutes. We have seen a new invention of parenthood so that same-sex couples can acquire children through reproductive technologies that are unrelated and never have to go through the adoption screening that unrelated adults have to go through if they want to. acquire parental rights over an unrelated infant. We have actually seen a complete overhaul of our parenthood laws because of Obergefell. So this was not simply about what two adults do in the privacy of their bedroom. This actually changed the way we regard the family and children themselves in our laws.
SPEAKER 04 :
I think that’s a powerful point. And you also brought up how problematic it can be when courts deal with the wrong victim and have the wrong question introduced here. So go further in that. I mean, and I appreciate what you said about Kim Davis. I mean, our hearts go out to her and her religious liberties, all that sort of stuff. But as it relates to Obergefell, wrong victim, wrong question that went to the court. Explain that for us.
SPEAKER 13 :
Yeah, so I’m no lawyer, but my understanding is that when you take a case to the court and it’s the wrong victim, or you’re asking the wrong question, you’ll get a wrong decision that can sometime reaffirm a previous bad decision. So even though Kim Davis is a victim, she’s not the ultimate victim. We do not need to bring a court case to the Supreme Court, in my opinion, that says, should a cake baker have to bake this cake? Should a woman have to arrange these flowers? Should Kim Davis have to sign this document? Like that matters, but that does not ultimately matter. The question the court needs to answer is, does a child’s own mother and father benefit them in ways that state assigned adults do not? That is the question that the court needs to ask because children are the ultimate victims. Christian adults who have to do something that violate their conscience, they are a victim. They are not the ultimate victim. The ultimate victim are children who lose their right to their own mother and father because the court has enshrined a false definition of marriage. I am spearheading a national coalition, FRC is a part of it, where we are going to retake marriage on behalf of children. And we are going to bring the kind of cases that represent the right victim, children, and ask the right question, do kids need their own mother and father? And if they say, yes, children have been victimized because of gay marriage, and yes, they do need their mother and father, then i guess they don’t get the full constellation of benefits that were promised before if those benefits involve delivering them somebody else’s child so that is what we are working to do we are going to um we have a campaign in motion if you want to go to endobergefell.com you can just sign up there and i will keep you in touch i will keep you updated on everything that we are working on But in my opinion, we do need to make sure that the court reevaluates this decision. In my opinion, the Kim Davis case was not the one that was going to be asking the right questions or representing the right victims.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, we saw it take decades to finally see Roe overturned, and hopefully it won’t take that long for Obergfell. We’ll see. But the wisdom that you’re bringing into all of this with getting the right victim and the right question, and God bless all these others as they come to the table. I don’t want to minimize that, but your point that we have to have the right victim, in this case, children. And the right question, the importance of a mother and a father in those children’s lives. And hopefully we won’t see this take decades and decades. How do people need to be praying? We’ve got less than a minute, Katie. How do people need to be praying as this effort goes forward?
SPEAKER 13 :
Pray for this coalition that my nonprofit, Them Before Us, is spearheading for the church leaders, the conservative influencers, the heads of organizations that care so much about marriage and family. We need to retake marriage on behalf of children. This is not about adult fulfillment. This is about justice for the least of these. So pray. Pray that we can change hearts and pray that we can change laws.
SPEAKER 04 :
We will do so. Katie Faust, founder and president of Them Before Us, thank you so much for joining us today on Washington Watch and for your great leadership in this battle before us.
SPEAKER 13 :
Thanks for having me, Jody.
SPEAKER 04 :
All right, friends, that wraps up today’s edition of Washington Watch. Again, happy Veterans Day to you. We’ll be with you again tomorrow right here on Washington Watch.
SPEAKER 01 :
Washington Watch with Tony Perkins is brought to you by Family Research Council. To support our efforts to advance faith, family, and freedom, please text GIVE to 67742. That’s GIVE to 67742. Portions of the show discussing candidates are brought to you by Family Research Council Action. For more information, please visit TonyPerkins.com.
