In this enlightening episode, host Roger Marsh engages with Pastor Jack Hibbs, the founding pastor of Calvary Chapel Chino Hills. From six people in a home Bible study to millions across the world, Pastor Hibbs has led a transformative journey. His discussion centers around his new book ‘Called to Take a Bold Stand: Resilient and Effective Faith for a Godless Age’, where he emphasizes the importance of living boldly for Christ in today’s culture without requiring superhuman courage.
You’re listening to Family Talk, the radio broadcasting division of the James Dobson Family Institute. I am that James Dobson, and I’m so pleased that you’ve joined us today.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, welcome to Family Talk, the broadcast division of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. I’m Roger Marsh, and today we’re going to hear my conversation with a pastor who’s been faithfully standing for biblical truth in one of America’s most challenging cultural environments. Pastor Jack Hibbs is the founding pastor of Calvary Chapel, Chino Hills in Southern California. What started as a simple home Bible study with just six people has grown into a ministry that now reaches millions of people all around the world. Pastor Hibbs is known for his passionate Bible teaching and his courage to tackle the tough cultural issues facing believers today. You might know him from his real-life network or his daily radio and television broadcasts. Well, during our time together, we discussed his brand new book, Called to Take a Bold Stand, Resilient and Effective Faith for a Godless Age. According to Pastor Jack Hibbs, taking a bold stand doesn’t require superhuman courage. It simply means being obedient to God’s word in our daily lives. His insights will encourage anyone who wants to live more boldly for Christ in today’s culture. Now let’s get into today’s conversation. Well, welcome to Family Talk, the broadcast division of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. My name is Roger Marsh, sitting in the co-host seat today. We are here in Colorado Springs, and we are joined by a very special guest who just got lost on his way to Calvary Chapel Chino Hills and wound up in Colorado Springs on a 49-degree day. Pastor Jack Hibbs, it’s good to have you back on the program, brothers.
SPEAKER 02 :
Roger, it’s great to be here. And it is 49 degrees. I was shocked because just the other day it was like 86. And so here we are. We’re not dressed for this. It’s bipolarado, my friend. Bipolar Colorado, but we’re happy to be in good company, Roger, with you.
SPEAKER 01 :
It’s interesting. Pastor Jack Kibbs, of course, is founding and senior pastor of Calvary Chapel Chino Hills. Did not initially set out to plant a house church from what I understand, but God called him to do it. And when you got guys like Chuck Smith at Calvary Costa Mesa speaking into your life, they’ve got that anointing too. Home Bible study, and now 40 years later or so, how many thousands of people are worshiping at Calvary Chapel?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, it’s great. We just celebrated our 35th year from launching as a church. You’re right. We started as six people, and my goodness, now with what’s happened— Even before the pre-COVID world, we had a great attendance, our large sanctuary, three services. But, you know, Roger, I got to tell you, we took a stand during COVID and God poured out his Holy Spirit. And so it’s almost impossible to actually number the church in the sense that we know how many seats we have. Yes. But what God has done is a miracle in what I call the… the post-COVID age, where the church now reaches an untold amount of people because we find ourselves on so many radio stations and now streaming, and then the real-life network has exploded, which is, again, something that is new. But the fact that as this church started as a home group, Roger, out of what happened in COVID— We now have home away groups. We call them affectionately home away groups. They’re in the hundreds. And most of them are in the U.S., but they’re not limited to the U.S., where people were watching online. And then they began to discuss and communicate at stores or supermarkets. sporting events with their kids. And they began to find out, wait a minute, you guys listen, you’re watching? Well, where do you live? Oh, we live on Apple Street. Well, gosh, we can get together. And they were 100% organic, Roger. We actually found out about these gatherings. We didn’t start them. The people who love Jesus in this nation and beyond started them. And so now we’ve, like Paul, like the scriptures, we’ve given them the right hand of fellowship. loosely affiliated, but now we recognize them and their home groups. Some of them have even grown into churches. Fantastic.
SPEAKER 01 :
Yes, sir. I love to hear that, especially when you see the way God used your life to say, we’re going to start a Bible study because that drive from Chino Hills and the 57 is no joke going to Costa Mesa.
SPEAKER 02 :
Built by Satan, we’re convinced of it.
SPEAKER 01 :
I wouldn’t be surprised. Though, I don’t know, having seen some of the roads in Texas, I kind of miss the good old days of those evil California roads, but I digress. What’s interesting, we’re going to talk about a brand new, last time we had Pastor Jack on the program, he was talking about his book that was new then, Living in the Days of Deception, How to Discern Truth from Culture’s Lies. And he’s got a brand new book called Called to Take a Bold Stand, Resilient and Effective Faith for a Godless Age. I’m so grateful that you’re here. You know, one of the things that we are gonna talk about about the book, Called to Take a Bold Stand, that’s something that you’ve been called to do. But of course, the namesake of this program, Dr. James Dobson. And this is the James Dobson Family Institute and Family Talk. And you and I have talked many times off mic about doctor’s impact on your life and the lives of other people. Can you take a moment before we get into talking about the book and just talk about the impact that, I mean, quite frankly, your story sounds like it’s tailor-made for a guy like James Dobson to speak into it.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, Roger, I’m telling you, this is a question that you’re giving me where the best answer would be Lisa and I answering this because I’m the one working at the job and we’ve got the little ones. And Lisa is a stay-at-home mom. A lot of that value she got from her upbringing, but it was reinforced by Dr. Dobson.
SPEAKER 01 :
Now, she grew up in a Christian home, but you did not.
SPEAKER 02 :
She did. I did not. She did. But by God’s grace, I wound up accepting Christ in 1977 and met Lisa about a year later. We were married a year after that. But one of the great things is that her values, Lisa’s family values, were just dovetailed perfectly when this guy comes on the radio. Mm-hmm. And people, they don’t realize today, Roger, unless they’ve been around a while, there was nothing like Dr. Dobson in those days. No one. Talk about a trailblazer and a visionary where you could listen to him on radio and he would talk about things that Lisa and I are going through either A, in our marriage, Or in family dynamics of mothers and fathers-in-law or brothers-in-law, whatever that might be. But children, bringing up children. And so he was a lifeline for us. We would not have known what to do whatsoever. And so you’re talking to someone, and I represent Lisa, where we’re on the user end. We are the ones who are children now who are in their 40s. They think we were really good, wise parents. All we did was regurgitate and repeat what we heard on the radio program, which look, let’s be honest, those are timeless truths. I mean, Dr. Dobson’s programming and instruction today, because it’s timeless, it’s maybe even more needed now because so much of America is really without educated parents when it comes to that.
SPEAKER 01 :
And what’s interesting about that is you benefited from the fact that he had training in psychology, that he was a parent himself, that doctor had taught public school for a couple of years as part of his initiation or whatever at a children’s hospital. I mean, no one willingly says, hey, go teach eighth grade for a couple of years. You know what I mean? You don’t want to be involved in middle school. It’s usually a sentence. Yeah, exactly. But in your case too, the thing that is so admirable is the fact that you didn’t grow up in a Christian home, Lisa did. You didn’t go to college. I mean, you don’t have that formal training, but you had this anointing and you picked up on the anointing that Dr. Dobson had too. And none of us could go toe to toe with that guy in clinical psychology, but his heart for reaching, I hear his heart when I hear you preach.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, thank you for saying that. I’m honored to hear that. Yes. people who will remember this you’re listening to a man back then who was of the psychology world which if you remember roger there was a lot of criticism in the evangelical circles regarding psychology do you remember that there was stuff called psychobabble and there were a lot of radio people who were bashing and so there were some psychologists who were definitely into the weeds yeah Then comes Dr. James Dobson. And what I loved about Dr. Dobson was that so many within the church didn’t know exactly what to do with him just yet. Because here’s this man who is highly educated, extremely influential. My goodness, you know better than I do. His opportunities to influence presidents and heads of state and governors and all. That said, here’s a man who comes along who is… Again, highly educated, appalled the apostle type when it comes to his knowledge, but he’s speaking like us. He brings this wisdom down to where some young kids who’ve got two little baby girls could consume what he’s saying. That is a gift. Usually a man of that stature would stay in his ivory tower. Oh yeah, he’d be in academia forever. And he could have. And he could have just stayed there. We see him in some ways as a prophet to the family. We see him as the parent that we parents needed to help us along the way. But what an amazing legacy he has given us to whereby… Lisa was brought up in a home where she’s the baby of nine. That whole dynamic is different. Yeah. I was brought up in a home without faith. I was a baby of three, but my brother, my sister, great age differences. That said, my parents didn’t talk. And my dad’s form of parenting was actually the belt. He never, rarely, ever spoke. Lisa’s family was different. But the beautiful denominator, what made things work, was not only us having a healthy appetite of the Bible, But to have Dr. Dobson be there, because we didn’t know what we’re doing. As parents, we did not know. And so I thought spanking was the answer. Just automatic, you know, just spank. And maybe you should spank anyway, just because. No, no, no. Lisa came along and she was the baby girl. So she kind of got some leniency, you know. And Dr. Dobson brought us together and brought sense to our lives.
SPEAKER 01 :
I think it’s phenomenal. One of the things that today on Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, we’re talking with Pastor Jack Hibbs of Calvary Chapel Chino Hills and the Real Life Network, which we’ll talk a little bit more about. It’s not a brag if you’re just stating the facts. How many hundreds of thousands of people are using the Real Life Network?
SPEAKER 02 :
We’re getting close to 500,000 people subscribing now, and it’s free, free subscription.
SPEAKER 01 :
Yeah. How can you stay in business if you keep giving it away, Jack? Isn’t it funny how God keeps showing up?
SPEAKER 02 :
I tell you what, God showed up during the time of COVID in a way where it’s funding itself.
SPEAKER 01 :
I love that. It’s just phenomenal to hear that. And I think that one of the things that we all can look at James Dobson’s legacy when we think about doctor. I can’t call him Jim or James. I have to call him doctor. Your new book is called To Take a Bold Stand. How many times did doctor take a bold stand? Always. Yeah, let’s think about it always. Yeah, the last meeting I had with him in his office, we were going over broadcast schedules because he approved all of our calendars right up until the very end. I mean, the August calendar was the last one he approved. And he passed August 21st. But we were talking about Christopher Yuan, who’s got that phenomenal ministry. Now he’s got the whole sexuality project. And Dr. looked and he goes, how is Chris? And I said, well, he’s got his doctorate now. And he goes, really? Boy, he’s excited, right? Like if it was his own grandson. That’s right. Or his own son. And then I said, now he’s getting into transgender ideology and he’s taking a biblical stance for it. And he lit up and he said, you know, Roger, I will die on that cross every day. Yeah. And he meant that. And the thing that I’m seeing now is that people are, I’m sure people are saying, I’m so glad Pastor Jack Hibbs is taking a bold stand. Hmm. And you’re writing a book saying, that’s not just me. Talk about that.
SPEAKER 02 :
Listen, somebody wisely said, I don’t know if it was Charles Spurgeon or A.W. Tozer, but one of the greats said, we get to stand on the shoulders of the greats.
SPEAKER 01 :
Amen.
SPEAKER 02 :
And so that’s what we’re doing with what Dr. Dobson poured into our lives. And so even very recently, Roger, at the time of this interview, less than 24 hours ago, I was going through some old broadcast of Dr. Dobson’s. He was being interviewed. I’m going to guess by the attire, by the look, it was maybe the late 80s, mid to late 80s. And he had said something then about, about that there’s a war on boys and masculinity. Now people need to hear this because it is more relevant than tomorrow. He was talking about a time could come if we did not reinforce a biblically based masculinity in the lives of our young sons, that they could become easily confused, easily lose their way. And if the rise of feminism, he said, takes the trajectory that it’s on, it may be that boys, we may lose the existence of boys. And here we are, he was a prophet in this area. And so we’re talking about a man who is a once in a lifetime come along man of God. This is his life, his ministry is a gift, not only to the church, But let’s be honest, you can be an atheist and listen to his programs and learn a whole lot because it was that practical wisdom from above, which is timeless. And so, yeah, we all miss him greatly. My passion is to do everything we possibly can to resurrect his message to the American family today, because without that American family that he talked about for all those decades, we will not have a nation in short order.
SPEAKER 01 :
And it’s coming much more quickly than I think even a lot of people want to realize. And I’m grateful that you’ve written this book. I didn’t know how you were going to follow up, you know, the days of deception with anything as powerful. But called to take a bold stand. The subtitle is perfect. Resilient and effective faith for a godless age. Can we talk about resiliency?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER 01 :
Yeah. Why are so many people, I mean, here’s George Barna. 72% of professing Christians say, I’m a Christian, but I basically believe I’m a good person.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 01 :
Sin doesn’t, you know, I don’t need salvation from my sin. I just have to be good. Yeah. Where did we, I mean.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, why is it, why are we all turning tail and running? Well, here’s the deal. You mentioned living in the days of deception. That’s exactly what we’re talking about. Mm-hmm. You know, when we think of the word deception, we think that Satan comes by with his red tights on with a pitchfork making you think a dumb thought.
SPEAKER 01 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 02 :
But living in the days of deception, I think, is Satan’s going to deceive. He’s going to deceive, I think, in the most subtle ways, could be the most dangerous. And so if people think they’re okay with God, but yet they disagree with the word of God, they’re deceived. And so the book, Living in the Days of Deception, covers these very things. But I like what you said a moment ago. You said, what could follow that book? Well, it’s this book for this reason. that if we’re living in the days of deception and we need to be discovering and discerning cultural lies, then what’s the next step? How are we going to do that? Roger, if you and I do discover a lie or deception, what are we gonna do about it? Forget it? Are we gonna sweep it under the carpet? No, we have to respond in boldness. We have to take a stand against the evil that exists. And so this book is actually a follow through. It’s part two. If you think about it where, okay, you’ve revealed and exposed the deception. Now what do I do? You take a bold stand and this is how you do it.
SPEAKER 01 :
I know so many people who have been encouraged by the bold stance that you’ve taken. And yet I don’t think that you or your wife would look at this and say, I don’t have camera right now, but Pastor Jack is shaking his head back and forth. Nope, nope, nope, nope. You’re just living out your faith.
SPEAKER 1 :
100%.
SPEAKER 02 :
Lisa and I, we get this from people. We were just at the steps of the state Capitol in Sacramento. Contrary to the New York Times, they said 200 people showed up. There was over 6,500 people that showed up. Nice, nice. That said, people were interviewing me and asking me, you know, where’d you get this courage? Where’d you get this boldness? And I was shaking my head a second ago because if they only knew. For me, it’s all about obedience to the word of God. Pure obedience because… Some people might think, well, you know, he probably takes a stand like that on everything. Actually, no, I don’t. Because there’s some things that I just don’t throw my gloves into the ring on that one. If it’s about this tax and about the price of gasoline, I’m suffering that with every Californian, okay? I’m not gonna do a sermon or call a rally in Sacramento. But when you come along and you say things like, A baby’s not a baby. A baby’s not a baby up to 28 days, and then I’ll decide if it’s a baby. Okay, you’re going to see me at the state capitol steps making some noise. If they come along and they say, yeah, you know what? In light of human trafficking and all the stuff that’s going on in California, The illegal alien situation. We’re going to try to get AB495 passed so that anybody can take your kid out of class.
SPEAKER 01 :
For those who are listening, because we’re nationally, what specifically is going on? What’s the language there? Because it sounds like a subtle end around. It’s amazing.
SPEAKER 02 :
It’s incredible. In fact, Roger, thank you for allowing me to speak on this right now. And by the way, everybody, in all 49 states, you better listen up because what happens in California comes to you really quick. So here’s the deal. It’s quite remarkable. There is an assemblywoman who wrote a bill. It’s called Assembly Bill 495. And we had all of our attorneys, by the way, look at it. Let me tell you, some of these attorneys that we have are men and women who you know their names. They are national names. They reviewed the bill and they said, this is, in most cases, the devil’s in the details. This bill is so short, so small, so vague that we have seen something here that is devilishly dangerous because here it comes. I got it, Roger. It’s not hard to quote. If someone has a printer and a computer at home, they can print out a California-recognized affidavit from their home computer, which is a legal document. In the document, it’s one page. It says, what is your name? You put your name down or you put whatever name you want to put down. Mickey Mouse. The child that you’re requesting out of school, did you try to contact the parents or guardians? Did you try? Did you try? Checkbox, yes or no. Okay. Next question is, what is the child’s name? The person writes the name in. Roger, the school, when they walk in with the affidavit, if this bill passes, no daycare center? Listen carefully. The devil is in the vagueness. It’s not limited to public school, private school, daycare centers. In fact, one attorney who I’m not going to mention his name, people would recognize said, this is so loosely written that someone could be visiting from some other state on vacation. And if that child or that teenager is separated from their parents, somebody could invoke the affidavit. And use it against this child, thereby trafficking this child. That’s why many critics have called it state-sanctioned trafficking. Wow. It’s hard to believe. A particular attorney said, this is quite possibly the single most dangerous bill we’ve ever seen in American history in 250 years. It’s that bad. So, Roger, the person having the child taken out of class and put into their custody— There’s no driver’s license required. There’s no address required, background check. There is no passport. There’s no social security number. There’s no data regarding this person. And when the author of the bill was questioned on this, she said it is to protect the illegal alien community because if the child’s mother and father were taken by ICE, then the child has no one to pick them up after school, right? You see, it is a bill of compassion and preparedness. And Roger, that’s how it spun. But the California Education Code 234.7 is a law we already have on the books to prevent that from happening. This is none other than a very dangerous bill, which is why I painfully said, and I still stand by it today, sadly, I told our church, if this bill passes and you have children, you’ve got to flee the state of California.
SPEAKER 01 :
Right, right. Let’s talk about where we are now in terms of the excitement, the enthusiasm. And for you personally, because I mean, you’ve been doing this a long time. I mean, and obviously this is the time of season when, and I think you and I might’ve even had a conversation or two about what your plan, how long does Pastor Jack stay in the pulpit?
SPEAKER 02 :
Wow, this is a conversation I have with myself every Sunday afternoon. I would have quit a long time ago if it wasn’t for her saying, you can’t do that. You can’t let that bother you now. So- We’ve got guys on staff now. We’ve got pastors. I’ve got pastors underneath me that I’ve trained up where, for example, I dedicated them when they were one year of age. Wow. Yeah. So most of our pastors have been with us from when they were little kids. And so… It’s a beautiful moment now where I’m here with you right now, for example. A lot of this is by design. It’s not just I love Roger Marsh. It’s that I’m deliberately away from the pulpit to have them more often exposed to the congregation and the congregation to them so that I can manage this transition while I’m still able to see that it doesn’t crash against the guardrails, right?
SPEAKER 01 :
Does that make sense?
SPEAKER 02 :
I can speak to their life and say, hey, listen, you gave a great message and I’m not concerned about your difficulties. I’m concerned about your successes because anyone can handle difficulties. It’s when Satan destroys us with success. And so I wanna walk these guys through that and that’s what’s going on right now. But pivoting from that full-time now real life network is consuming my time.
SPEAKER 01 :
That’s phenomenal. And I’m sure the half million plus people who are benefiting from that. And that’s just the subscribers. I mean, that doesn’t include the people who are the residual.
SPEAKER 02 :
Exactly.
SPEAKER 01 :
And you can watch it without subscribing. Pastor Jack Hibbs, the book is called Called to Take a Bold Stand. And the idea, the concept of having a resilient and effective faith in a godless age, it sounds really heavy duty. It sounds like a big exhortation. What you’re really saying is just go be a Christian.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah. Can you imagine? Be a first century Christian.
SPEAKER 01 :
There you go. How about that? I love it. I love it. Don’t ask for anything from Rome. Don’t expect the government to change and solve all your problems. Stand up against injustice and be the church.
SPEAKER 02 :
Amen.
SPEAKER 01 :
Jack, you’re a treasure. Thank you for being with us today here on Dr. James Thompson’s Family Talk.
SPEAKER 02 :
Thank you, Roger.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, what a privilege it was for me to be able to sit down with Pastor Jack Hibbs and hear his heart for standing boldly in today’s culture. You’re listening to Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, featuring my conversation with Pastor Jack Hibbs about taking a bold stand for biblical truth. Now, if you missed any portion of today’s broadcast or if you’d like to share it with someone who needs encouragement, go to drjamesdobson.org slash family talk. And once you’re there, you’ll also find a link for Pastor Hibb’s brand new book. It’s titled, Called to Take a Bold Stand, Resilient and Effective Faith for a Godless Age. You know, for the past 15 years, the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute has championed the sanctity of human life, supported biblical marriage and parenting, and stood for religious freedom in an increasingly hostile culture. And while Dr. Dobson has since gone on to be with the Lord, our mission today remains as strong and urgent as ever before. And here is extraordinary news. Through the historic Dr. James Dobson Memorial Matching Grant, your gift will be doubled dollar for dollar through December 31, 2025, up to $6 million. Dr. Dobson’s words have shaped families and inspired faith for generations, and now through this historic matching grant, you have the opportunity to ensure his legacy not only continues but also multiplies. Every dollar you donate will be doubled, placing practical biblical wisdom into the hands and homes of countless families for years to come. Together, we can honor Dr. Dobson’s vision, preserve his teaching, and multiply the impact of your generosity. You can make a secure donation online at drjamesdobson.org. You can also call with your tax-deductible contribution. That number is 877-732-6825. Or if you prefer, you can send your tax-deductible donation through the U.S. Postal Service. Our ministry mailing address is Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, PO Box 39000, Colorado Springs, Colorado, 80949. Well, I’m Roger Marsh, and from all of us here at the JDFI, thanks so much for listening today. Be sure to join us again next time right here for another powerful message from Pastor Jack Hibbs, talking about fulfilling Dr. Dobson’s vision for the family and the church. That’s coming your way right here on the next edition of Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, the voice you can still trust for the family you love. This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
