What does it mean to be truly known by God? On today’s edition of Family Talk, Roger Marsh continues his inspiring conversation with physician Dr. Saundra Dalton-Smith to discuss her new book, Being Fully Known. She explores the transformative journey of beholding, becoming, and belonging that leads to spiritual rest. Learn how to break free from negative self-talk and discover your unique place in God’s puzzle. To support this ministry financially, visit: https://www.oneplace.com/donate/707/29
You’re listening to Family Talk, the radio broadcasting division of the James Dobson Family Institute. I am that James Dobson, and I’m so pleased that you’ve joined us today. Well, welcome once again to Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, the voice you trust for the family you love. I’m Roger Marsh, and in a world that constantly pushes us to perform, to achieve, and to do more, many of us struggle with the courage to simply be who God created us to be. On today’s edition of Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, we’ll continue exploring the profound journey toward authentic living with board-certified internal medicine physician Dr. Sondra Dalton-Smith. In her brand-new book called Being Fully Known, Dr. Dalton-Smith speaks directly to those of us who hold back our true selves out of fear of vulnerability or rejection. Using her unique background as a physician, a spiritual mentor, and coach, she helps bridge the gap between the longing to express our true selves and the beliefs that keep us in fear-based living. Dr. Sandra Dalton-Smith has touched countless lives through her work, appearing in outlets like Prevention, MSNBC, and TED.com. But today’s conversation goes deeper than professional accomplishments. It reaches into the heart of who we are and how we can embrace being fully known by God and others. And this is a conversation that we had at the National Religious Broadcasters Convention in Dallas, Texas, not too long ago. During the next half hour, we’re going to continue the conversation with a question about this fundamental challenge many of us face, knowing we need to simply be as God intended, but struggling with how to actually do it. Dr. Dalton-Smith, what does it mean to be?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, I opened up the book talking about Psalm 4610, be still and know that I am God, because that is the scripture that I feel like has been taunting me most of my life because I am not a person of stillness. But I feel like that is what being is all about, being separated from the things we do and being rightly connected in a state of constant abiding. where our work is not coming out of our own strength, but it’s coming out of the flow of God through our lives, where we stay open enough. Our hands are not overly occupied, but our hearts stay open enough to receive on a continuous basis. And to me, that’s what being’s about, being available.
SPEAKER 04 :
And presenting yourself before the Lord every day. I mean, we see that in scripture. You know, we’re coming to him with our hands open, hearts open, eyes open, ears open, saying, God, what do you have for me? And I remember meeting the actor Dean Jones years ago in the final years of his life. And his motto was, I eat whatever God puts on my plate every day. That’s the way he looked at it.
SPEAKER 02 :
Oh, that’s beautiful.
SPEAKER 04 :
I love that image because he knew what it was like to be back in the 60s and 70s. He was a number one box office movie star. And then all of a sudden the scripts came and they weren’t quite as family friendly. And he turned them down. He didn’t work for three years, but he said, look, this is who I am. And God led me here and he’s leading me here. And I’m just going to keep, keep on doing it. You have created something that you call the abide act framework. I would love for you to kind of walk it through. I mean, what was your intention with it? How did we do this in our daily lives?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah. So because I am a bit of a workaholic, I have to admit, that’s my mindset. I started praying and asking God, show me a rhythm that I can work as someone who likes accomplishments. I like to be able to check the box. I like to be able to see metrics and see that I’ve moved a goal along. And this was a framework that came out, the Abide Act framework. I also call it the 2-8 framework as well, because For two weeks, I like to, if there’s any goal, I spend two weeks abiding. I start asking Holy Spirit questions. I start diving into the scripture. I start allowing myself to really go deep into the knowledge of God, trying to get His understanding of how I should proceed. And then the following eight weeks are the weeks of action. Those actions are kind of taking them in small chunks and blocks to kind of move it along. So that whatever the goal is, I’m seeing constant progress. We recently started a foundation called the Send Foundation, where we’re working with youth who are in entrepreneurs and low income areas who don’t have the opportunity for entrepreneurship programs to kind of teach them some of those things. And then women who are in other countries who are doing entrepreneurial things. And as we’re doing that, that’s a lot of work. And so if you try to take on any kind of project, specifically something that you feel like God’s laid on your heart, if you try to eat the whole elephant, you will give up because it’s like there’s too much to do. What I find is this abide act principle gives me stepping stones along the way. And I pause during those moments of abiding those two weeks and then eight weeks of acting. And then you go back to the another two weeks and those periods make sure that I don’t get too far off track. So I don’t kind of end up in a place I didn’t want to be.
SPEAKER 04 :
I love the two week concept of the abiding first and just kind of letting it ruminate a little bit because I have, you know, my eyes are bigger than my stomach and everything looks good. Sounds good. What a great idea. We should do this. We should totally do that too. And my wife is the same way and her mind is just going constantly. So then we’ll get a month or two down the road and go, remember that? Oh yeah. Maybe we didn’t abide on it. It looked really good in the moment. And with smartphone technology and everything, people are more image-driven. It’s coming at you a lot faster and more furiously. To really take a couple of weeks and say, okay, God, if this is you talking to me, then I’m going to be acting on this.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, I’ve had moments where I go into the abiding and I’m like, God, I know this is you. I know it. And the next act part was character building. It’s like, OK, it could still be me. I’m not giving you the next step. The next step is I need you to work on this part of who you are. And that’s hard sometimes. Oh, sometimes? My goodness. And then you get to your next abide. And the next abide might be something very specific called, you know, somebody who you’re like, maybe I should contact this person and some next steps. But I think when we enter into those moments, as long as we enter in really with our heart surrendered. You know, one of the topics in the book I talk about is this word hineni. And this relates to our yes to God. I’m someone who in the past, every time I felt like God asked something, I would say, yes, God. But my yes was not a surrendered yes. It was like, yes, I want to see this, this, and this. When I learned actually kind of the definition of the word, my answer is yes before you even ask the question. I thought, I don’t even know how to do that. And so that was one of my abide periods. It was an abiding of learning that word. And then eight weeks of how do I get my heart healed from the disappointments of the past, God? Places where I prayed this and it didn’t happen. How do I tax my expectation from the outcome? And that was a journey that needed to go on. As an author, you expect so many books to sell. You expect this, that, or the other. I needed to learn to celebrate that I gave an obedient yes without actually having to see whatever my hope or outcome was from it.
SPEAKER 04 :
Boy, you just hit on something so heavy with regard to disappointment. I wonder how many of us are being held back from the things that God really has in store for us because we were disappointed once or twice or many several times. And then it’s like, okay, well, God, now you’re calling me to this again. Well, you know, it didn’t work out so good the last time. That’s no fun. It’s an act of obedience, isn’t it?
SPEAKER 02 :
Can we celebrate that we obeyed?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 02 :
I think we don’t celebrate that. We are like, well, God, it didn’t work out. What if the working out was that you obeyed?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yes. Oh, that’s fantastic. We’re talking with Dr. Sondra Dalton-Smith today, being fully known as the name of the book. And it’s one we highly recommend. 2 Timothy 1, verse 7, Spirit God gives us does not make us timid, gives us power, love, and self-discipline. All three of those things together are a pretty powerful combination. How do we apply these to breaking free? Because we talked about disappointment, we talked about fear, talked about anxiety, and it’s all a lack of obedience at some point. you know, where we say, if God’s calling us to it and we don’t want to do it because we don’t want to get hurt, then we’re basically saying, sorry, God, not today, which kind of messes with his sovereignty.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, the very first part of the book, the holding section of it, we actually talk about power, love, and the whole book is talking about self-discipline to some degree because it’s reevaluating parts of your journey with God. I think for one of the things I’ll mention there regarding power is, is that there’s a section we talk about that’s Unrivaled Capacity is the title of that particular chapter. And it talks about the, I call it spiritual firewalls that some of us put up. Because the way the Spirit of God moves is unconventional to what the world expects. Right. And oftentimes we get very comfortable with stable type things. But the Spirit of God is not described as stable things. Wind, water, fire, these are not stable substances. They have their own life to them. And so I think we have to kind of disassociate our level of dependency on stability on external surfaces and things and really put our focus on stability on the rock alone, on Christ alone. Yeah. And once we do that, some of our spiritual firewalls will come down where we try to control how things are moving in the spirit because it moves beyond what we feel is safe.
SPEAKER 04 :
And familiar. Oh, absolutely. Yes. Comfortable. Comfortable. And the devil, you know, you know, for lack of a better phrase, how often do we limit God or put barriers in his way because we want what’s familiar and familiar? OK, it may not be perfect, but at least I know what I’m getting here. You know, I mean, I’ll stay with that. My marriage is falling apart, but at least if I can hold this much together, you know, my relationship with my kid, I’ll stay in that job, you know, whatever it is. We’ll stay in that house. We’ll stay in that neighborhood, whatever it is. And you’re calling us to say, hey, look, if you can release the fear, you know, God has something better for you and you really can experience beholding, becoming and belonging.
SPEAKER 02 :
And you enter into a type of rest, I feel like that remains for most of us. This settledness of the soul, the stillness of the spirit that comes just because you’re not in the doing and letting that be your primary focus.
SPEAKER 04 :
Let’s talk about something that I know has been a big challenge for a lot of people. And that is something called negative self-talk, right? I mean, we all have that voice inside our head. You know, we hope it’s the still small voice of the Holy Spirit, but oftentimes it’s your mom or your dad or your teacher or your coach or somebody who was really giving you a bad time about something. How do we first of all acknowledge what that negative self-talk is compared to maybe God calling us into a season, like you said, of character building? And then how do we… Well, it does keep us trapped, doesn’t it? I mean, if you’re always hearing that voice telling you that thing over and over again, after a while, you’re going to eventually, it’s just going to become a part of what you say, not what the voice says. Sure.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, I think we have to get really honest about how different voices and opinions affect us. You know, we talk about trauma, but trauma comes in different forms and different levels. And so I think sometimes, not sometimes, many times, the words of people traumatize us and it causes this level of withdrawal. And so one of the things I talk about is friendly fire within the book, which is where people that, you know, you have an idea, you feel like God said something, you share it with someone else. And then either they give you the loss attack, which is them telling you, you know, you shouldn’t do this. But the agenda really behind it isn’t that you shouldn’t do it. It’s that they’re afraid they’re going to lose something in the process. Maybe lose that relationship. Maybe lose that closeness or whatever. Sometimes it’s a safety attack. They’re afraid for your safety, but it’s really more their fear than it is the risk that you’re taking.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 02 :
And so I think we have to recognize that sometimes when we come under these friendly fire from people that we love, when we try to step out, we acknowledge what it is that is the real issue. And not just get mad at them and separate from families and all of these things, but actually take a step back and say, which attack is coming here? And how can I address that? And allowing ourselves to then also have a level of confidence in when we do feel like we’ve heard from God. If you’re doing your abiding and your act periods and you are beholding and taking time, getting wise counsel, I highly believe in mentoring and discipleship. So if you’re doing those things and you have a firm belief you’ve heard from God, then the friendly fire is just that. It’s an opportunity for you to stand with courage. Yeah.
SPEAKER 04 :
I never really thought about the whole armor of God. You know, Ephesians 6 is protecting you from friendly fire, too. But it really does. I mean, the way you’re describing it is so perfect. I wonder how many people are dealing with… feelings right now that we haven’t seen in modern time. I mean, the loneliness epidemic, you know, everybody’s all connected on social media, but they’re all powerfully lonely at the same time. Talk about the idea that those of us who are looking to find connection with people really can find it. And instead of just saying, well, I’ll keep a social media profile and that’s how I’ll stay connected to people. I’ll send a We really do need people that we can interact with. But it sounds like what you’re saying, sometimes the disappointment or the loss or that kind of fear keeps us from being our authentic selves with them because, oh, there’s somebody else who isn’t going to get me.
SPEAKER 02 :
That’s so good. And it goes down to that emotional and social rest aspects of it. Emotional rest, meaning that you have the ability to share your feelings without censoring them. A lot of us experience what I call professional emotional labor. In other words, we keep our emotions close. This is what I dealt with is the reason I burned out, because as a physician, I’m treating people in the ICU sometimes that are friends. And so I can’t bust into tears, even though I’m an empath and I’m really soft hearted. I have to keep it together because I have people that are depending on me. And so there’s stress associated to shutting down your emotions. And a lot of us do that in all kinds of ways. The customer service person who’s being nice while someone’s yelling at them. And so there’s so many different layers to that. And then with social rest, we have people who… spend a lot of time with people who have demands upon their social energy, but they don’t have anyone who they are being fed by. There’s nobody life-giving in their life. So it makes me think of who’s nurturing the nurturers. And so when we think about the loneliness epidemic that people are experiencing right now, I think we have to have people stop and evaluate, are there safe places where I can share my raw emotions without feeling I’ll get judged, whether that’s with a family member or counselor or therapist, whatever. And are there people in my life that are life-giving, who don’t need anything from me, who can pour back into me and I can get filled back up in those experiences? And the beauty of it is, you know, there’s so many different ways to get some of these types of rest. Some people get emotional rest by like doing art. I always joke, you know, I did medical school in Nashville at Meharry Medical College and every achy, breaky heart song you’ve ever heard is an emotional rest song. It’s somebody sharing their emotions authentically. So some people might find, you know, David was a psalmist. He wrote his emotions out. And for some of us, you may not have another person. You may be single or you may be a widower and you don’t have another person you feel safe to do that. You can write it out. You just have to get it out of you so that you can process through those emotions.
SPEAKER 04 :
And it’s interesting how when we do that, you look at David’s Psalms, for example, especially the ones of lament or the my enemies are attacking me, the imprecatory prayers. And then how many times he came back to I will remember, I will remember. And it’s like he had to empty himself of that before he could get to the point where it was just him and God. And he said, but you know what? You’re true. You’re faithful, you know, and that’s kind of the beginning of true worship is this lamenting that happens. And I wonder how many of us, I mean, if we could paint a visual, you know, a picture of people carrying around these bags full of, you know, backpacks and things of just hurt and anger and loneliness, whatever, that God never intended for us to carry. And yet now you’ve given us tools with this brand new book to kind of work through those and find out where he is so we can find out where we need to be.
SPEAKER 02 :
Absolutely. Because in that process, whatever you walk through, if you are fully known, the areas of yourself that you’re willing to share with the world, someone else will get blessed from it. God can redeem it. There’s an opportunity for you to take whatever that was, the pain, the successes and everything in between and let him use it for his glory.
SPEAKER 04 :
As a medical doctor, I appreciate and respect what you do. My sister’s been a registered nurse for 30 years. And I love the fact that she would never let me say, well, today I saved a life or we saved a life at the hospital because she knows that God’s the only one who can rescue him. But it’s interesting to see how you’ve got this medical expertise, but you’re also a woman of faith. And how do you see those working together? We don’t all have the opportunity to go through med school like you did to understand all the inner workings of the body. But how can we see the two? Because I think we’re in a culture right now, I hate to say it, where the medical profession is kind of put above medicine. the spiritual realm. Have you experienced that too? Or people say, well, I trust the science on this one. So don’t give me the spiritual answer for belonging. Cause there’s gotta be some kind of pill I can take or some kind of retreat I can go on.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yes. I definitely hear that quite a bit because people want a quick fix. You know, what I’m describing is a process that you walk through. People want a quick fix, but quick fixes usually do not have a full effect. So you get a quick up and then you get a flat line after that. So I think for myself, what I’m finding is I feel like the science and the Scripture complement each other beautifully. The Scripture is the answer of all of it. And the science helps us to be able to apply it to our lives. And I think the more we can understand about how to apply the Word of God in our life, the more we actually can see the effects of what we see in the Bible. And so that’s a big part of my writing journey and coaching and the different things I do. It’s like, how do we go deep into the word of God? And then how do we get it deep inside of us? I often say I prescribe medicines and a lot of it comes in scripture and verse.
SPEAKER 04 :
Interesting. Interesting. Now you mentioned writing being a journey for you as opposed to I ran all these tests and I came up with all this knowledge and now we’re just going to transcribe it and publish it as a book. Was this new book, The Being Fully Known, a journey for you as well? And if so, what did you learn?
SPEAKER 02 :
Every book’s a journey. Okay.
SPEAKER 04 :
Jerry Jenkins once told me, he said, people ask what kind of writer I am. Am I an archer? He said, I’m a pantser. I said, what’s that? He goes, I fly by the seat of my pants. I never know what’s going to happen to my characters in these novels. And it sounds like, but I love the writers who do that and say, okay, we’ve got a hypothesis. Let’s work it through and let’s see what comes out on the other side. Instead of like, I know exactly where this is going and I just have to write it down.
SPEAKER 02 :
This is a journey for you.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 02 :
It certainly is. And it’s funny you say that. Jerry Jenkins is actually one of my mentors and actually endorsed my book.
SPEAKER 04 :
Love it. Love it.
SPEAKER 02 :
Because that is how I write. I write from a place of this is my experience. This is what I’ve seen with other people. This is the research and the science. And this is the scripture. And it’s taking people on the same process that I’ve walked through and walked others through. And so even within this particular book, there’s lots of reflective questions. I’m someone who really believes in the discipline of fasting. I feel like there’s a great benefit in fasting and whatever that looks like for you. And I even include a 21-day fast within this book being fully known because I want people to realize it’s not just something from the Old Testament. It’s something that we can actually use right now to help us during our abiding times, help us during those times we need to reconnect.
SPEAKER 04 :
What’s the response been to the book? And I know it’s just now coming out. And what were you hoping? I mean, does that line up? I mean, obviously you have some expectations. This is like having a child, right? And you want everyone, you know, millions of people to read it. But what’s the response you’re getting from people?
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, it’s really interesting. We’re here at NRB, so I’ve had a chance to do quite a few interviews. And one of the things that I was surprised is how many people will honestly say, that’s the scariest title I’ve ever read. Really? Being Fully Known. Uh-huh. And we go into these deep conversations about the fear behind being known. How many of us are living in this sense of, I have to ward myself away from people because of the concern about being hurt. Hmm. And so I think it really tells a lot about the world we live in. And the more we start discussing the topic of being fully known and they kind of see the benefit for themselves, that’s, I think, what I’m loving. And that’s the response I wanted, is for people to, just like my mentor said to me, to get to that place where they are living free. And they are not struggling to try to fit in, but they are okay that God made them unique. And however, their traumas and dramas and past and all the things that went into their life, how God can use that and how it’s needed. It’s like that puzzle you were talking about. There’s a spot that they just slip right into. And they’re not going to maybe look like the entire rest of the puzzle, but they are an expression of his character, an expression of heaven that is needed in that community, that school, that church, that business. And I pray people walk into that.
SPEAKER 04 :
I think that’s wonderful. And puzzle pieces by themselves look weird, right? I mean, they’re just the goofiest shapes. But when you put it all together in that tapestry of color and pictures and whatever, then you see what God really had in mind and say, oh, okay, now I see my piece in that puzzle. Amen. Dr. Sondra Dalton-Smith, thank you for this book. Thank you for our conversation today. Again, it’s being fully known as the title, the scariest title in publishing, according to some people here at NRB, the joyful satisfaction of beholding, becoming, and belonging. And we’ve got a link for it up at drjamesdobson.org. Dr. Smith, thank you for being with us today here on the broadcast.
SPEAKER 02 :
It’s been my pleasure. Thank you.
SPEAKER 04 :
In our relentless pursuit of doing, Dr. Sondra Dalton-Smith reminds us there’s profound freedom in simply being, stepping away from constant performance to experience the rest that comes when we embrace our true identity in God. On today’s edition of Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, you’ve heard the conclusion of a two-day conversation I had with author, speaker, and physician Dr. Sondra Dalton-Smith. Now, if you’d like to go back and listen to part one, you’ll find it online at drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. That’s also where you will find a link for Dr. Sandra Dalton Smith’s book called Being Fully Known, The Joyful Satisfaction of Beholding, Becoming, and Belonging. You’ll find that information and more at drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. Each day this week, we’ve been celebrating Dr. Dobson’s birthday here on Family Talk. And in honor of that occasion, we’ve put together six of Dr. Dobson’s most impactful books on family and faith. And we’re calling this collection the Building a Family Legacy Bundle. This collection includes classics like Bringing Up Boys, Bringing Up Girls, The Strong-Willed Child, Straight Talk to Men, and the Complete Marriage and Family Home Reference Guide. Several of these books even include bonus DVDs with additional instruction from Dr. Dobson as well. These resources provide biblical wisdom for every stage of family life. And we’ll be happy to send you the Building a Family Legacy Bundle as our way of thanking you for your gift of any amount in support of the ministry here at the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. So you can make your donation online at drjamesdobson.org. That’s drjamesdobson.org. You can also give us a call at 877-732-6825. Or you can send your request through the U.S. Postal Service. Our ministry mailing address is Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, P.O. Box 39000, Colorado Springs, Colorado, the zip code 80949. Once again, our ministry mailing address is Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, or you can just address JDFI for James Dobson Family Institute if you’d like. Post Office Box 39000, Colorado Springs, Colorado, the zip code 80949. Well, I’m Roger Marsh, and on behalf of Dr. Dobson and all of us here at the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute, thanks so much for listening today. Be sure to join us again next time right here for another edition of Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk, the voice you trust for the family you love.
SPEAKER 01 :
This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
SPEAKER 03 :
Hello, everyone. Roger Marsh here for Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk. The news comes in all shapes, sizes, and formats these days, but how do you cut through all the noise and get to the heart of the matters that affect your family? Well, come to Dr. James Dobson’s Family Talk and sign up for Dr. Dobson’s monthly newsletter. You’ll find clarity on tough issues, encouragement for daily life, and trusted principles to help you build strong, healthy, and connected families. Go to DrJamesDobson.org and sign up today. That’s DrJamesDobson.org. Thank you.
