- Posted December 17, 2025
On today’s program: Casey Harper, Managing Editor for Broadcast at The Washington Stand and Host of the “Outstanding” podcast,…
Menu
In this engaging episode of Washington Watch, host Tony Perkins dives into pressing national and international issues with key political figures. The discussion opens with an informative overview of the current state of budget reconciliation and the strategic measures in play to enhance national security. Congressman Andrew Clyde joins the conversation to shed light on the legislative tactics employed by the House Freedom Caucus and their budgetary milestones. With the added perspective of federal judicial interventions, the program provides a comprehensive look at the fiscal matters shaping the Congress’ agenda.
SPEAKER 14 :
from the heart of our nation’s capital in Washington, D.C., bringing compelling interviews, insightful analysis, taking you beyond the headlines and soundbites into conversations with our nation’s leaders and newsmakers, all from a biblical worldview. Washington Watch with Tony Perkins starts now.
SPEAKER 16 :
I have the smallest margin in history, about a two-vote margin currently. So I’ve got to make sure everyone agrees before we bring the project forward, that final product. And we’ve got a few more boxes to check, but we’re getting very, very close.
SPEAKER 06 :
That was House Speaker Mike Johnson yesterday on Fox News Sunday discussing the path forward on the long-awaited budget reconciliation proposal. Welcome to this Monday edition of Washington Watch. I’m Tony Perkins. Thanks for tuning in. Well, South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham, chairman of the Senate Budget Committee, says he’ll move forward this week with a two-step budget reconciliation plan, starting with a measure focused on border security and funding. The House Freedom Caucus supports a similar two-measure approach. We’ll discuss it with Georgia Congressman Andrew Clyde, a member of both the House Appropriations Committee and the House Freedom Caucus. National Security Advisor Mike Waltz spoke on Meet the Press yesterday, defending efforts to cut wasteful, misdirected taxpayer spending.
SPEAKER 11 :
You have seen hearing after hearing after hearing on this. And the current chairman of the Foreign Affairs Committee and the past in the House completely support an overhaul of USAID. It has become incredibly bloated. It’s become incredibly top heavy. And it’s essentially a series of contracts.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, it’s telling that calls for government accountability and efficiency have become a source of such heated debate. Meanwhile, a federal judge temporarily halted the Trump administration’s plan to reduce the USAID workforce on Friday. We’ll talk more about this with Katherine O’Neill Gillian, former White House liaison to USAID and the last Trump administration. India’s Prime Minister Narendra Modi is slated to meet with President Donald Trump on Thursday. Despite India’s troubling human rights record, the previous Trump administration maintained a friendly relationship with Modi. Unfortunately, conditions for Christians and other religious minorities in India have worsened over the past four years. In fact, at the end of last year, nearly 400 Christian leaders sent a letter urging Modi to address the systematic violence fueled by Hindu nationalism toward Christians and others. We’ll get the latest on the situation in India from Isaac Sikh, CEO of the Sikhs Group. And finally, over the weekend, Hamas released three more hostages, but their condition is causing significant concern.
SPEAKER 07 :
I know we have a deal where we’re supposed to get, they dribble in and keep dribbling in. But they are in really bad shape. They have been treated brutally, horribly. Even the ones that came out earlier, they were in a little bit better shape. But mentally, they were treated so badly. Who could take that? You know, at some point, we’re going to lose our patience.
SPEAKER 06 :
That was President Trump yesterday on his way to the Super Bowl in New Orleans. We’ll hear from CBN’s Chris Mitchell in Israel about the status of the now very fragile ceasefire agreement between Israel and Hamas. All of that and more on today’s edition of Washington Watch. If you’ve not yet downloaded the Stand Firm app, that will give you access to Washington Watch no matter where you are. In addition, you’ll have access to the Washington Stand, FRC’s steadily flowing news and commentary flow from a biblical perspective, as well as our daily biblical commentary. Stand on the Word. You can get it in the App Store. Or you can simply text the word APP to 67742 and I’ll send you a link. House Speaker Mike Johnson said yesterday the House Republicans are getting very, very close to a final budget reconciliation package. But it’s uncertain if it will get marked up this week as planned. Meanwhile, Senator Lindsey Graham, as I mentioned at the top of the program, plans to mark up his own budget resolution on Wednesday that will take a two-bill approach compared to the one-bill approach that the House Speaker and others have been promoting in the House. With the House scheduled for a week-long recess next week, how might this week unfold? Well, joining me now to discuss this and more is Congressman Andrew Clyde, a member of the House Appropriations Committee and the House Freedom Caucus. He represents Georgia’s 9th Congressional District. Congressman Clyde, welcome back to the program. Good to see you. Tony, great to be with you this evening. So just within the last few hours, the House Freedom Caucus released a statement saying they are prepared to move forward with a two-bill reconciliation package. Give us the latest on that.
SPEAKER 08 :
You’re absolutely correct. The House Freedom Caucus met over this past weekend, and we did a lot of work on this and introduced this particular budget reconciliation that is the two-step process, somewhat in line with what the Senate is doing. We’re offering $100 billion to both judiciary and to Homeland Security in order to help with border security and $100 billion to national defense as well. Coupled with that is almost $500 billion worth of spending cuts. So it’s a two and a half to one, all right, spending cuts over additional spending. But we need the additional spending for border security to ensure that border czar Tom Holman has the funds he needs to accomplish the mission that he was given by President Trump that the American people have demanded, and that is eliminating or removing, rather, violent, illegal aliens from our country. Budget reconciliation, I think, is the best path forward. You know, whether there’s two bills or one, I’m good with either. But we have seen the one bill stall. And so this is the strategy now that we’re moving forward with is the two bill. And this is an actual piece of legislation that we can take up and vote on.
SPEAKER 06 :
My understanding is I had a conversation actually earlier today with Senator Graham and that the funding for the border security is about depleted. So this is needed now rather than later.
SPEAKER 08 :
That is correct. Tom Holman needs this funding right now. They are running out of money to accomplish this mission. You know, it’s not surprising to me that the Biden administration drained all of the accounts, the DHS accounts that would be necessary for them, for Tom Holman. and Secretary Nome to accomplish this mission of deportation. You know, that’s just what the Biden administration did. And so we’ve got to be absolutely as quick as we can to get funding to them so they can do what they need to do.
SPEAKER 06 :
Now, I understand this, as you said, there’s cuts in this initial one bill that is being proposed, but there’s additional cuts that would come in the second bill, if I’m not mistaken, if I read correctly what’s being proposed by the Freedom Caucus.
SPEAKER 08 :
That’s right. It’s a two-step process. And we sent out a letter that actually talks about the second budget reconciliation package, which would deal with the tax cuts that President Trump has promised the American people, deal with the continuation of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act, which is about to expire at the end of this year. But then also you’ve got the no tax on tips, and you’ve got some incentives for manufacturing as well that need to bring that back into this country. All good things that will spur economic growth. And so what we will see is that one will be paid for with economic growth, all right, on one side, but then significant tax cuts on the other to the tune of about $1.5 trillion worth of tax cuts, which is absolutely necessary if we are going to move forward with the, excuse me, spending cuts, spending cuts, not tax cuts, spending cuts in order if we’re going to move forward with the tax cuts that President Trump wants.
SPEAKER 06 :
All right, Congressman Andrew Clyde, the big question is, all right, is there agreement in moving forward in the House? Because the clock is ticking.
SPEAKER 08 :
The clock is definitely ticking, and we are working on that. You know, if we can get the more moderate side and the right side, the Freedom Caucus together, which is what we’re working on right now, then the middle will come with us. And I am confident that we will be able to pass this type of legislation.
SPEAKER 06 :
What do you see as the sticking points at present?
SPEAKER 08 :
Well, You know, some folks are very, very convinced that only the one bill process will work. I’m not convinced of that. I believe that people want tax cuts. All right. And we need to pay for those. And I believe that people want border security. But border security must come quickly. And we don’t have the time because the tax cuts portion of it is very complex. So we don’t have the time to get both of those together into one bill and pass it. That’s just my opinion of it. But we certainly do have the time to get the border security and the defense portion of it done in very short order, because that’s the primary focus right now. We have time to do the tax cuts.
SPEAKER 06 :
So the the the. the approach with the one bill was that all of those elements, for instance, the border security, the defense, which those two issues are more popular, that that would gather all of the support of conservatives, whereas some of the other elements, which are maybe not as popular, would be difficult to get all the Republicans on board. I mean, you’re a part of the Freedom Caucus. Would all of the Freedom Caucus members vote for what’s contained in the second bill, in your opinion?
SPEAKER 08 :
In my opinion, I think we would. In fact, we’re actually pressing that issue right now with the speaker. So I believe that it would be the Freedom Caucus, the right side of the conference, would certainly be in support of it. I think where you have some sticking points is more the moderate side, those from New York or California that have the The higher taxes, and we have the little state and local tax issue that was capped in Tax Cuts and Jobs Act. It was capped at a $10,000 deduction. It’s kind of going a little bit into the weeds, but that’s one of the sticking points that I think we can certainly overcome.
SPEAKER 06 :
They met with President Trump. They talked about that issue when they met with him, when the more moderate members met with him down at Mar-a-Lago. Would they potentially sink the entire – reconciliation process or at least the second bill based on that?
SPEAKER 08 :
My gut feeling is, no, they wouldn’t. The American people have spoken loud and clear when it comes to President Trump. They elected him. He said this was one of his absolute main focuses. Securing the border was one, deporting illegal aliens along with securing the border, and then tax cuts, extending his 2017 tax cuts. That was his other primary focus. I don’t believe in my heart of hearts that Republicans will stand in the way of President Trump accomplishing that agenda.
SPEAKER 06 :
Last question on that topic. Is it possible to see movement on it this week? Because the Congress is scheduled to, the House is scheduled to break Thursday afternoon and will be out next week.
SPEAKER 08 :
Well, that’s going to be up to Speaker Mike Johnson. I’m sure he has seen this bill that was just, you know, put forward today and chairman of budget, which is Jody Arrington. And it’s going to be up to them whether this moves forward this week or not. I certainly hope that it does. I know that we’ve got a budget meeting tomorrow to talk about this and to see what path maybe this can give us. But I’m encouraged. I’m encouraged with what the Freedom Caucus put out. This is a good plan. It could work.
SPEAKER 06 :
Final question for you. Got about a minute and a half left. The backdrop of all the efforts of the Department of Government Efficiency being led by Elon Musk, you know, cut. We’ve been talking about cuts. We’ve got a bloated government. We’ve got to cut. Well, Democrats are melting down over what’s going on. What do you make of the response from Democrats?
SPEAKER 08 :
Well, you know, I’ve always said that in government, sunlight is the best disinfectant. And I think that that’s what Doge is doing. That’s what Elon is doing. He’s bringing sunlight to this issue and showing all of the massive waste, fraud and abuse. And this judge, you know, I think Engelmeyer in what he is doing in stopping them with the judicial order, which I think has no merit whatsoever. You know, it’s tremendous judicial activism. I think President Trump called it out very severely. And and this has to stop this kind of judicial activism because, you know, for the Democrats to be opposed to eliminating waste, fraud and abuse and making our government more efficient is just stunning. That goes to show you they have no message.
SPEAKER 06 :
It is stunning. You’re absolutely right. Congressman Andrew Clyde, always great to see you. We’ll be tracking this very closely and hope to talk to you again real soon. Great to be with you, Tony. Thank you. All right, folks, stick with us. We’re going to talk more about USAID on the other side of the break.
SPEAKER 03 :
During these challenging times for our nation, Family Research Council continues to serve as a watchman on the wall for faith, family and freedom. And together, thanks to your support, we’re making an eternal impact. 2024 was a year of shining the light for biblical truth in Washington, D.C. Last fall, over 1,000 spiritually active, governance-engaged conservatives gathered for the Pray, Vote, Stand Summit to pray for our nation and ensure that the issues impacting sage cons were understood and advanced. Washington Watch with Tony Perkins marked a major milestone this year, its 900th episode, and added the Washington Watch News Desk, a new production that presents the top news each day from a biblical worldview. The Washington Stand published 2,000 articles of news, commentary, and podcasts in 2024, garnering over 5 million views. FRC’s outlet for news and commentary continues to pursue the truth on the issues that matter most to you and your family. And with the launch of the Stand Firm app, you can listen to, watch, and read our content in one simple place. Pray for current issues, stay rooted in the scriptures, and engage the political sphere with the community of believers on our new platform. In 2024, FRC shaped public policy and culture, organizing the National Gathering for Prayer and Repentance where members of Congress and Christian leaders came together to seek God’s intervention in America. In May, FRC called upon believers to pray for and stand with Israel by dedicating a portion of their worship services to pray for Israel’s peace, prosperity, and protection. With Pray, Vote, Stand Decision 2024, FRC and Real Life Network led a powerful evening of election night coverage to analyze the election results and pray that our nation would turn back to God. We also filmed a transformative educational course, God and Government, Launching early this year in January 2025, this series will explore the biblical and historical foundations of our government, empowering you to stand confidently in your role as a citizen of heaven and earth. Family Research Council thanks you for partnering with us, and we look forward to 2025 and standing for faith, family, and freedom.
SPEAKER 02 :
Looking to grow closer to God in the new year? FRC’s Stand on the Word spiral-bound journal is here to help. Dive deeper into Scripture with thought-provoking questions, note-taking space, and context for each book and author. This second edition, covering Isaiah 2 Revelation, will guide you in tracking your journey through God’s Word while deepening your faith in Christ. Order now at frc.org slash store or text journal to 67742. Perfect for you and your loved ones.
SPEAKER 06 :
Welcome back to Washington Watch. Good to have you with us on this Monday. And again, I encourage you to get the Stand Firm app. You can go to the App Store and look for Stand Firm. That way you can watch Washington Watch no matter where you go. Also, you’ll have access to our news and commentary, The Washington Stand. Well, as the left continues to rant and rave against the Trump administration’s effort to tackle the bloated agency that USAID has become, Republicans maintain that drastic measures are necessary to tackle the fraud, fraud, waste, clearly abuse that has not only plagued this agency, but quite frankly defines it. Considering how Democrats claim they want more transparency in government, Is that something that only applies in areas where they think the GOP will look bad? I have to applaud the Trump administration going in and cutting. You can restore, you can build back up if you need to, but it’s layer upon layer upon layer. Here now to offer an insider’s perspective on this is Catherine O’Neill Gillihan, former White House liaison to USAID. Catherine, welcome to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER 09 :
Thank you so much, Dr. Perkins. And I have my little one here in my lap. So you can see the top of her head, but she’s joining us too.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, that’s great. That’ll be her first live interview on Washington Watch. Make sure you put this in her baby book.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 06 :
So let’s talk about that. You were appointed toward the end of the Trump first term of the Trump administration to clean up the personnel within the agency and shut down a lot of these programs that are now all coming to the forefront. Did you see any accountability that was expected from those in USAID when you were there?
SPEAKER 09 :
No, I didn’t. I mean, if you look at the federal workforce and if you were to put them on a political spectrum, I would say about 97 percent of them are on the left. And so they’re not going to want to do some of the things that we wanted to do. And that’s just the reality. And I did actually serve at the State Department first for three years in the first term, starting in the beginning in 2017. So I had three years of experience dealing with these sorts of programs and funding and everything at the State Department. And then I went back to the campaign in 2020. And that’s when I got a phone call to come in the day after the election in 2020 to start you know, revamping some of these efforts.
SPEAKER 06 :
That’s, I think, a great vantage point to look at USAID from the State Department, because it’s supposed to work in concert with our foreign policy to support and really further American priorities in our foreign policy. And I worked very closely with the former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo when I served on on the U.S. Commission for International Religious Freedom, and often found that USAID, although there were some good folks at the top in the last administration, in the Trump administration, often was working at counter purposes.
SPEAKER 09 :
Absolutely. You know, that’s actually where I started at the State Department was the Office of International Religious Freedom with my beloved former boss, Pam Pryor, who I believe you know pretty well. So we were started in the Religious Freedom Office and then we were moved up to the undersecretary’s front office that covered a lot of these programs, democracy, human rights, labor, refugees, trafficking, et cetera, et cetera. And the problem was that you would have two tracks. You would have one coming out of the State Department, and then you’d have one coming out of USAID. And oftentimes, they weren’t on the same page. And if you go back and look at the Foreign Assistance Act of 1961, which followed the executive order that President Kennedy put in place to establish USAID, it says in the first few sentences of the bill that it should be under the advisement of the Department of State. So Trump’s team is doing nothing out of character or out of the law, and I think that’s the way it should be.
SPEAKER 06 :
If nothing else, what they’re doing is they’re pulling it back to the original intent that it is to be a tool of our foreign policy through the State Department. How many on the left are appalled that Secretary of State Marco Rubio is reigning in USAID? But, you know, based on the history and the statute, the creation of it you just stated, aren’t those reactions a little overblown?
SPEAKER 09 :
Absolutely. They’re totally overblown. And I think, you know, actually, Secretary Rubio issued a bunch of waivers saying that there are some programs and fundings that are mission critical and in alignment with our national interests. And these people, these… recipients of the funding have to apply for the waivers. And there’s so much insubordination that I was talking to a friend of mine who’s in the thick of things. And he was saying that there were some employees that were refusing shipments at ports just because they wanted to protest this, you know, the halting of these aids. I mean, the insubordination is so deep and it’s so out of control. And Secretary Rubio has every right to do what he’s doing. President Trump has every right. And I think courts and we’ll prove that.
SPEAKER 06 :
I think you’re right. When you have someone that is working an agency or those within the agency working at counter purposes to the commander in chief who was elected by the people to carry out a particular focus, America first in this case, he should expect those that work within those agencies to follow suit. I just have a little over a minute left, Catherine, let me ask you this. So we know that it doesn’t always, they’re misdirected in many ways, but what about the waste? Did you see firsthand a lot of waste and abuse of taxpayer dollars?
SPEAKER 09 :
Absolutely. There’s just a general malaise within federal agencies. I’m in the private sector now. I started a business about four years ago, and we’ve been doing really well. We’re very successful. But there’s a general malaise, and there’s not a fire to get things done in the government. And so there would be meetings to have meetings to have meetings, then to make a plan. And so there’s just a lot of wasted time and a lot of inaction. And I think President Trump this time around is putting people in place that are coming from the private sector that know how to get things done and know how to do them efficiently and quickly. And that’s what the American taxpayer should want out of our government.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, I think you’re right. That’s quite evident that he is doing that. And he comes in this time much different than he did in 2016, knowing that people are not necessarily going to get in line and maybe time for them to get out if they’re going to work at counter purposes. Catherine, I want to thank you for joining us. And your little girl was great.
SPEAKER 09 :
Thank you so much, Dr. Perkins. It was great to see you.
SPEAKER 06 :
All right. Have a great day. All right. Look, the left is squealing like a stuck pig because we are seeing government cut, moving away the layer after layer after layer after layer of bloated misspending. All right, don’t go away. We’re back after this with more.
SPEAKER 07 :
Oh, beautiful for spacious skies.
SPEAKER 01 :
At the 2025 National Gathering for Prayer and Repentance, hundreds gathered with Christian and government leaders at the Museum of the Bible in Washington, D.C. to pray for the nation and ask God to forgive us of our sins.
SPEAKER 06 :
We gather here not to appeal to 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. We are appealing to heaven. Today we make our appeal not in the authority of a political party or in the name of a denomination. We come in the name and the authority of Jesus Christ. who has been given all authority in heaven and on earth, and we have been commissioned to operate in that authority.
SPEAKER 13 :
Father, we pray in Jesus’ name for our complacency, our greed, our pride, our gluttony, our sloth and tolerance of sin.
SPEAKER 10 :
Lord, your word is the food that can make America healthy again. May your word be exalted and believed in our nation again.
SPEAKER 15 :
Lord, we ask that you allow us to become that shining city on the hill once more for your love, your grace, and your mercy.
SPEAKER 16 :
I thank you for your love and your grace and your mercy, for the opportunity that you have provided us to heal our land. We ask you to do it, Lord. We ask you for the wisdom, discernment, and stamina to do the thing that you have called each one of us, all of us here, to do. May we be found faithful. We trust it, pray it, believe it all. In Jesus’ name, amen.
SPEAKER 06 :
Welcome back to this Monday edition of Washington Watch. Glad you have joined us. Well, India’s Prime Minister Narendra Modi is scheduled to visit the United States this Wednesday and Thursday, and he will be meeting with President Trump, someone he’s called a friend. Well, in a tweet today, Modi said that the visit will cement India-U.S. friendship and boost ties in diverse sectors. Well, given all of President Trump’s actions last week, including an executive order on eradicating anti-Christian bias, will there be a discussion on the increasing threats to Christians and other religious minorities in the prime minister’s own country? Joining me now to discuss this situation is Isaac Six, co-founder and CEO of The Six Group, an organization that advances human rights, religious freedom, and the cause of liberty around the world. Isaac, welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you for having me, Tony. Good to be here.
SPEAKER 06 :
So, Isaac, you know the situation in India quite well. At the end of last year, nearly 400 Christian leaders sent a letter to the prime minister and to the president in India asking for them to address this issue of systematic violence that’s being targeted at Christians. This situation has grown worse over the last several years. Is this something that President Trump should discuss with Modi this week?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yes, absolutely. I think the president has an incredible opportunity to make a deal here with the prime minister. I think in the past they’ve had a good relationship. And this is an issue the president’s made clear is at the top of his foreign policy agenda. He made that clear last week during the National Prayer Breakfast. He made it clear with the creation of the White House Faith Office. And the vice president made it clear at the International Religious Freedom Summit. So they have an opportunity here to make an arrangement that’s going to help both India and Americans, especially Christian Americans who are looking at this and are incredibly concerned about the amount of persecution that’s happening in some parts of India.
SPEAKER 06 :
This is very important when you look at the growing relationship between the United States and India, which India is, quote unquote, the largest democracy in the world. I’m not so sure. It makes the term pretty elastic to wrap it around India. But there’s a lot of economic ties, a lot of businesses, Fortune 500 companies doing more business in India. And of course, we’ve made a lot of focus on China and their abuse of religious minorities, their treatment of Uyghurs. But India is not far behind.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, that’s right. And you’re right. This is a big issue on two fronts. The business relationship is huge. You’re talking about almost upwards of $200 billion in trade between India and the United States on an annual basis. And this issue actually has direct overlap when you’re talking about religious freedom. India now has 12 states that have these anti-conversion laws, and they’re often misleadingly called religious freedom laws. But these laws make it almost impossible to legally change your religion. And there have been hundreds of Christians over the last few years in these 12 states who have been arrested or charged with criminal penalties for basic things like praying for the sick or attending a church service. I’ve met with these Christians. I’ve been in their homes, seen the bruises from the beatings they’ve taken for it. Ironically, often they’re beaten and then arrested by the local police. So I think the president has a chance to bring those cases up. India, the states need to drop all charges against these individuals. But we’re talking about 12 states. That means 700 million Indian Christians and Indians citizens in those states who are not free to simply choose and change their religion as their conscience dictates. So that’s a big issue. And that directly impacts business in the country. It directly impacts our business with India. So I think this is something the president has an opportunity to have a win on.
SPEAKER 06 :
Isaac, during my time on the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom, we tracked India. In fact, there were some that wanted to see India as illicit as a country of particular concern. threat to Christians is similar in some ways to what we’ve seen in Nigeria, and that the government is not directly perpetrating it, although they’re fueling it with some of their statements, their anti-Christian statements, but they’re turning a blind eye to those who attack Christians. Is that an accurate assessment of still what is happening there?
SPEAKER 04 :
That is accurate. And really at the local and the state level is where we need to see change. That’s where Christians are getting arrested. Pastors are being arrested for holding simple church services. And the police are not giving them an opportunity to state their case. The judges are biased against them. That’s where at the federal level, the prime minister of India, Prime Minister Modi, can really weigh in here. But yes, I mean, the facts are clear. USURF has recommended India for country of particular concern. Open Door says India at number 11 on their watch list. Global Christian Relief on their red list has India as number one globally for destruction of Christian places of worship and buildings. So the facts are clear. The issue is clear. Now we just need to see progress made.
SPEAKER 06 :
What would you like to see President Trump ask Prime Minister Modi to do specifically?
SPEAKER 04 :
Specifically, the top ask is for the release or the dropping of charges against the Christians at these local levels who’ve been arrested or charged under anti-conversion laws. We need to see that stop. And I should be clear, there’s parts of India where you can practice your faith freely and not have issues. It’s a big country. Places like Delhi and others, you can have a church and be fine. But in places like Chhattisgarh and Andhra Pradesh, there needs to be a dropping of these charges. So if the president could just ask the prime minister about those who have been charged with crimes under anti-conversion laws. That would be a win in and of itself.
SPEAKER 06 :
Does the, at the federal level there, the prime minister have the authority to weigh in with those state leaders?
SPEAKER 04 :
I would guess without looking closely at the laws that he’s not able to directly cause those charges to be dropped. He’s just going to have to informally talk to state leaders, talk to local leaders and ask for.
SPEAKER 06 :
Same way we do it here in this country. There’s always strings attached and there’s ways to to encourage people to do the right thing. Isaac, we’re out of time. I want to thank you for joining us. Appreciate the work that you do.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you, Tony.
SPEAKER 06 :
And folks, this is one of the issues to be praying about as the president meets with with Prime Minister Modi on Thursday that that he would weigh in. All right. We’re going to go to Chris Mitchell in Israel next. So don’t go away. Hello, I’m Tony Perkins, president of Family Research Council here in Washington, D.C. Behind me is one of the most recognizable buildings in all the world, the U.S. Capitol. What does it stand for? Well, most people say government. But you know, the Bible talks about four institutions of government. You know what they are? And do we have a republic or a democracy? Well, what do you say? Also, what about this thing, separation of church and state? Does that mean Christians shouldn’t be involved in government? Guess what? We address those issues and more in our new God and Government course. I invite you to join us to see what the historical record and the Bible has to say about government. Join us for God and Government.
SPEAKER 12 :
The world is hurting, streets are filled with crime, families are broken, sin is celebrated, and God is mocked. Everywhere we look, the wages of our sin are on full display. As Christians, we know that surrender to God’s will is the solution to our biggest problems, but not everyone agrees. Even in church, we hear people say the most important thing is to be tolerant, that we shouldn’t impose a morality on other people, and that loving our neighbor means celebrating what they do. But you can’t do that. It’s not that you don’t love your neighbor. You do. But you care about God’s opinion more than your neighbor’s opinion, and this makes you different. In fact, sometimes it makes you feel alone, like you’re the only one. But there is good news. You are not alone, not even close. Research has found that there are 59 million American adults who are a lot like you. There are millions of people around the country who are born again, deeply committed to practicing their faith, and believe the Bible is the reliable Word of God. But that’s not all. They’re also engaged in our government. They’re voters. They’re more likely to be involved in their community, and they’re making a difference in elections. The problem is that a lot of them feel alone, too. We want to change that. FRC wants to connect these 59 million Americans to speak the truth together, no matter the cost. If you want to learn more about this group and what it means to be a spiritually active, governance-engaged conservative, or if you want to find out if you are one of these SageCons yourself, go to frc.org slash SageCon and take the quiz to find out. The world is hurting, and we have the solution. We can’t do it alone, but we can do it if we work together. That’s what we’re working toward every day. Join us. Go to FRC.org slash S-A-G-E-C-O-N, SageCon, to learn more. That’s S-A-G-E-C-O-N, SageCon, to learn more.
SPEAKER 06 :
Welcome back to Washington Watch. Good to have you with us on this Monday. All right. Be sure and get our first 100-day toolkit. You can get it by texting the word toolkit to 67742. That way you’ll know what’s going on. You’ll know what to do. Because I’ve said many, many times, our republic was not made for spectators. It’s made for participants. So be a participant. Do your part. Get your toolkit. Text toolkit to 67742. Our word for today comes from Jeremiah, Chapter 14, where Jeremiah points to the false prophets as an obstacle to the people repenting of their sin and returning to God. Then I said, Ah, Lord God, behold, the prophets say to them, You shall not see the sword, nor shall you have famine. But I will give you assured peace in this place for every message of repentance and warning of the judgment for sin. There were false prophets proclaiming it was time to enjoy the best of life. and not to worry about the naysayers. Well, look at the defining characteristics of the false prophets in verse 14. And the Lord said to me, the prophets prophesy lies in my name. I have not sent them, commanded them, nor spoken to them. They prophesy to you a false vision, divination, a worthless thing, and the deceit of their heart. You see, they lie in the name of the Lord. They are not sent by God. They do not speak the Word of God. They proclaim a false vision. So, how are we to discern the truth from a lie? Well, we need to know the truth, meaning we need to know the Word of God. To join us on this journey through the Bible, text BIBLE to 67742. All right. Israel received three more hostages from Hamas on Saturday as a part of their hostage and ceasefire deal with the terrorist group. Now, the condition of these three were noticeably much, much worse than the hostages who were released before them, prompting strong reactions from both Israel and the U.S. Even the U.N. Human Rights Office expressed concern today. Now, according to the reports, Hamas intends to delay the next hostage prisoner exchange that was slated for this coming Saturday, alleging that Israel, Israel has violated the agreement. Now, is this fragile deal coming apart? Joining me now from Jerusalem to discuss this is Chris Mitchell, Middle East Bureau Chief for CBN News. Chris, welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us. Great to be with you, Tony. A lot to talk about. I want to get reactions from the Israeli population to Prime Minister Netanyahu’s visit here to D.C. last week. But I want to start first with the reaction this weekend to the release of these latest hostages and the condition that they were in.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, Tony, I would say there would be outrage throughout the country, especially its leaders, Israeli President Isaac Herzog, Prime Minister Netanyahu. I spoke yesterday to Deputy Foreign Minister Sharon Haskell and just said the scenes there were just heartbreaking. And she not only blamed Hamas, but she also blamed the United Nations for not advocating for the hostages and especially the Red Cross. who actually participated and has for the last several weeks in the hostage releases and yet hasn’t taken the time or fought, as she said, to go ahead and make sure there were visits to these prisoners held in captivity for over 490 days. We know that their conditions were just horrific. Many of them, some, I think these men were kept in tunnels for the entire captivity, left on a starvation diet. Many people here, you know, comparing their appearance to what appeared to many of the hostages, the Holocaust survivors, that is, and evokes echoes of the Holocaust. So throughout Israel, I think just heart wrenching. and horrific images that they had to see, just gut wrenching. And one more ride on this emotional roller coaster that Israelis have been on ever since October 7th, and especially in this last several weeks of these hostage releases week by week, but apparently now stopped by Hamas.
SPEAKER 06 :
One other aspect of this, this is not the first time we’ve seen it, but these three were kind of paraded around, forced by armed terrorists to read statements before their release. This clearly is not a part of the agreement to parade them through the streets in front of terrorists as if they were trophies.
SPEAKER 05 :
Exactly. And the one before that, some of the hostages were literally surrounded by crowds that were just pressing on them and Hamas gunmen. So this is a propaganda tool by Hamas. Actually, we understand that an Al Jazeera journalist helped stage some of these events. You have the parading up. There’s a banner behind them. One of the banners has said, Zionism will not win. So it’s all part of a propaganda effort by Hamas to humiliate these hostages. And actually part of their plan has been for months, and that was discovered by documents by Yair Yassin, the former or the late Hamas leader, to help divide Israeli society. Those that, on one hand, want to do anything to release the hostages, even with the many hundreds of Palestinian prisoners, or even an end of the war. So this is all part of the dilemma that Prime Minister Netanyahu THE SECURITY CABINET HAVE TO DEAL WITH HOW TO MANAGE AND DECIDE HOW TO PROCEED WITH THE WAR AS WELL AS TRYING TO PROCEED, TRYING TO RELEASE ALL OF THESE HUSTAGES BOTH DEAD AND ALIVE.
SPEAKER 06 :
extremely difficult situation for the prime minister and his war cabinet. Because I can imagine if you were a hostage family, I mean, you want your loved one released. You want to get them home no matter what. But now we’ve heard originally that there was some expectation that those in better condition would be released first. They would hold back others. And then with what we witnessed this weekend, you have to wonder what the condition would is of those that are remaining as hostages.
SPEAKER 05 :
That’s right. And, you know, some of the hostages have been saying exactly what kind of conditions they were in. Some didn’t see actually any other hostages for their entire captivity, just to the very end. We’ve heard reports that Hamas has actually had to teach some of these captives to walk because they weren’t able to walk because of the restricted diet they were on, malnutrished, malnourished, and in a very, very… difficult uh… physical condition you know there’s several groups here uh… tony in israel first of all you have a hostage of families and as you say they’ll do they want to do anything they can to get their loved ones uh… freed and also but you have the people that uh… know that prisoners, the Palestinian prisoners that have been released will likely and historically will go on to commit other terror attacks. So you have Israelis who wonder who could be the next victims of terror or in some of these murderers, the victim families are seeing that they’re these perpetrators of murders of their loved ones are released. And then you have, Tony, the the ones The men and women who have fallen in battle and their families are saying, we don’t necessarily want the end of the war. We don’t want those members of our families to have died in vain. So such a difficult time for Israeli society on so many levels.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, a clear prayer point for us back here in the States, praying for the leadership there in Israel, praying for a managed peace to emerge out of this. And so that really sets me up for my next question. Chris Mitchell is… Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and members of his team were here in Washington last week, had a chance to meet with him on Monday evening before he met with President Trump. I think in having spoken to some of those around him after his meeting with Trump, The meeting went much better than they anticipated. Very positive meeting. So as you’ve heard the public comments from the prime minister glowing about the meeting, close relationship, strong statements of support coming from the president. What was the reaction there in Jerusalem and beyond there in Israel to the meeting last week?
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, I think for one, Tony, Israelis are just exuberant about President Trump and the kind of support that he gave to Prime Minister Netanyahu last week, the kind of greeting he gave at the White House, for that matter, a huge difference than what would happen under the previous administration. where now Israelis feel like they have a tailwind behind them with the U.S. backing them and President Trump. But for the last 16 months or so, before January 20th, they had a headwind with the Biden administration, keeping up, keeping weapons from them and not helping them diplomatically. just a sea change in the difference, and I think Israelis are quite excited. They’re also, you know, and I was talking to some of them earlier today, they’re quite agreeable to this whole idea of what’s going on in Gaza, this whole idea that they would relocate the people from Gaza, and then the U.S. and other nations would come and rebuild Gaza. Whether or not that actually is going to come to fruition remains to be seen, But I think Israelis here really, really appreciate the new administration and the new White House.
SPEAKER 06 :
I spoke to some of the president’s advisers over the weekend regarding that proposal. And I think clearly it was designed to shake up the conversation and move beyond the old narrative of, well, we need a two-state solution. And it’s, you know, it never has worked. resulted in anything, because it’s unworkable. And I think October the 7th has proven that a two-state solution there does not work. So, I think the president is trying to create a broader conversation and involve many of the surrounding nations in getting involved in this, because they have been pretty much hands off. They don’t want to touch the Palestinian issue. This, I think, will force them to the table.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, and there’s many reasons why they don’t want to deal with the Palestinian issue. You know, ever since October 7th, for one, Egypt has had closed border and they haven’t allowed any, hardly any of the Palestinians to leave Gaza, although that’s what’s happened historically in many conflicts where people are, refugees are allowed to leave. And so that’s something that Egypt has really been resisting. Historically, it’s been very difficult for Jordan and or Egypt to bring in people that have been raised on an ideology of the Muslim Brotherhood, which represents a mortal threat to both of these countries. So that’s part of the reluctance that they’re going through right now. Also, Tony, you know, just in the last few hours, as you said, Hamas is abrogating the deal. They’re blaming Israel for it. And so President Prime Minister Netanyahu, that is coming from a, you know, a wonderful week of meetings from Congress to the White House, but now coming into a crisis. The Israeli defense minister, Yaakov Katz, is saying the IDF is going to be put up to its highest alert inside Gaza. So we’re not only maybe looking at an end of the hostage deal, maybe a resumption of fighting inside Gaza, and certainly a time to be praying for all of the leaders of Israel, for all of the Israelis, especially the hostages’ families, but what may happen in the decisions being made as we speak right now in the security cabinet.
SPEAKER 06 :
Chris Mitchell, we just have a few minutes left. I’m going to dig a little deeper into that, explore that a little further, because now the situation is you’ve got Hamas saying the deal’s off, we’re not going to release these other hostages. Well, that then triggers a political reaction on the Israeli side of the equation, which forces the prime minister, because you have some conservative members to his right that are saying, look, we need to finish this thing anyway. But then he’s got the hostage issue. families that are saying, we’ve got to get these hostages back, and this deal appears to be the only way to do it. This is a very difficult way forward.
SPEAKER 05 :
It’s a very difficult, delicate balancing act that the prime minister has to go through. Ben Gavir, who is one of the political parties that actually has left the government in the last month or so, he’s saying we need a full-out assault on Gaza right now. But you also have… the decision to be made about what to do. And I think it seems to be clear right now that really this is Hamas that’s making this decision. And if we look in a broader perspective, Tony, probably Iran may be pulling some of the strings behind the scenes. And that is another major issue that I’m sure President Trump and Prime Minister Netanyahu talked about. But a very difficult, political, delicate issue balancing act that Prime Minister Netanyahu has to go through right now.
SPEAKER 06 :
I think obviously the families lose out here because I think this may be the last chance for a clear resolution of the hostage situation. But Hamas and the Palestinians are going to lose out big time. Because then there’s no reason not to eliminate Hamas and move forward with even the proposal that President Trump put on the table of basically clearing out the Gaza Strip and moving the Palestinians out. They could be the big losers in this.
SPEAKER 05 :
Very much so. In fact, they’ve been the big losers since October 7th, even though they’re claiming victory. And right now and also Hamas spokesmen are saying October 7th is not the end. They want to continue the fight to eradicate Israel, kill the Jews. So their fight continues to go on, even though they’re sort of. doing this out of the rubble of the last 16 months of fighting. And as your point, Tony, it may be the hostage families that are tragically not gonna be able to survive this or their loved ones not be able to survive. So it would allow Israel to go in if Hamas is gonna be intractable and saying the deal is over and we’re not gonna allow any more of the hostages released. So such a tragic situation for many of these families. but they’re holding on to prayer and hope.
SPEAKER 06 :
All right, Chris Mitchell, we’re out of time for today. I want to thank you for joining us. But just to recap here, we need to be praying for the prime minister and his war cabinet as they decide the way forward. We need to be praying for the hostages, for their release, and for the hostage families that have to bear the grief and the burden of this. Chris Mitchell, always great to see you. Thanks so much for joining us today.
SPEAKER 05 :
Great to be with you, Tony.
SPEAKER 06 :
And folks, this will be part of our prayer points with our 100-day toolkit, because this is a part of the overall policy picture here in Washington, D.C. So I encourage you to get the toolkit to 67742. All right, thanks for joining us today, and do be praying. Until next time, I leave you with the encouraging words of the Apostle Paul, founded Ephesians 6, where he says, you’ve done everything you can do when you’ve prayed, when you’ve prepared, and when you’ve taken your stand.
SPEAKER 14 :
By all means, keep standing. Washington Watch with Tony Perkins is brought to you by Family Research Council and is entirely listener supported. Portions of the show discussing candidates are brought to you by Family Research Council Action. For more information on anything you heard today or to find out how you can partner with us in our ongoing efforts to promote faith, family and freedom, visit TonyPerkins.com.