Join the Grace Evangelical Society’s experts as they answer listener questions regarding the cessation of sign gifts such as tongues and miracles. Bob and Ken examine scriptural evidence and theological perspectives to argue for the historical and biblical understanding that these gifts ended with the apostles. Tune in for a thought-provoking discussion that challenges modern claims of apostolic gifts and emphasizes the foundation of the church laid by apostles and prophets.
00:00:00 Introduction and Spiritual Gifts Overview
00:12:07 Conclusion and Encouragement to Listeners
SPEAKER 01 :
The following is a listener supported ministry from the Grace Evangelical Society. All believers have a spiritual gift. Some of the gifts given by the Holy Spirit are called signed gifts. What does this mean? What was their purpose? And are they still in operation? Thank you for joining us today on Grace in Focus. We’re glad to have you with us. We come to you from the Grace Evangelical Society. Learn more about us at our website, faithalone.org. There you will find many articles that you can read and a bookstore. Available right now, among many others, Bob Wilkins’ latest release, Grace is Still Under Siege. The website faithalone.org. Now with today’s question and answer discussion, here are Bob Wilkin and Ken Yates.
SPEAKER 02 :
Bob, we got a question from MB. MB has got a question about spiritual gifts. He specifically mentions you. that you made a statement. The first part of the question is, how can you say that the gift of tongues was not or is not for all believers? And then part B related to it is, why do you say that all the signed gifts, including tongues, had ceased by the end of the age of the apostles?
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, the first question is easy. The second question is hard. So let’s take the first question. If you turn in your Bibles, if you’re driving, please don’t turn in your Bible. Just turn in your brain. 1 Corinthians chapter 12 and verses 29 and 30. This is where Paul is talking about spiritual gifts and talking about how God has given various spiritual gifts to various people in the body of Christ to edify local churches. And he says in verse 29, are all apostles. You expect the answer is?
SPEAKER 02 :
No. And I think everyone agree with that, right? Right. Not everyone is an apostle. Are all prophets? I guess, again, everyone would say no. Even people who believe the sign gifts are operating today would say no, not all are prophets. Are all teachers? The answer would be no. Are all workers of miracles? No, they would say some can’t do miracles. Do all have the gift of healing? And once again, the answer would be no. Do all speak with tongues? And there you go. The answer is no. Do all interpret tongues? No.
SPEAKER 03 :
But earnestly desire the best gifts. Well, guess what? He started with the best gifts first and went to the lowest gifts. The lowest gifts were tongues and interpretation of tongues. The highest gifts were being an apostle, being a prophet, being a teacher, being a worker of miracles, etc.,
SPEAKER 02 :
And it’s interesting that he picks the teaching gifts because we all need those. We need teachers to teach us the Word of God.
SPEAKER 03 :
So remember Paul said, all are not the hand or all are not the foot. If we were all hands, then how would we see? If we were all eyes, how would we walk? We need the entire body. And Zane Hodges has suggested that Paul is saying each one of us have one gift. There are a lot of people who say we each have multiple spiritual gifts, right?
SPEAKER 02 :
And plus, I’ve heard it that some have more than one gift. Okay. Yeah, but the way I’ve always heard it is every believer has at least one gift.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah. And I’m now of the opinion that I think each believer has one, but maybe not.
SPEAKER 02 :
Would you say someone like Paul was an exception?
SPEAKER 03 :
Yes. That’s a good question. I think the apostles all were able to manifest all the gifts because a gift of apostleship. allowed them to do everything. We know Paul said he spoke in tongues. We know Paul healed people.
SPEAKER 02 :
We know he had the gift of apostle.
SPEAKER 03 :
He raised the dead, right? He was an apostle. He was a teacher. He worked miracles. He did healings. He was evidently able to interpret tongues, although we’re not told. That’s one thing we don’t know if Paul did. But these other things he was able to do, and he certainly, well, I’m not sure. Did Paul give prophetic messages?
SPEAKER 02 :
Wouldn’t we say that since the mystery of the church was revealed to him and he did it, wouldn’t that make him a prophet?
SPEAKER 03 :
In that sense, yes. And not in the sense of revealing future things, but I’m not sure if he didn’t do that as well. But yeah, the New Testament term prophet probably includes more than just telling about future events. It’s giving messages from God. And Paul certainly did that as the author of 13 books. So, in answer to his first question, to MB’s first question, we know all didn’t speak in tongues because Paul says so.
SPEAKER 02 :
Right.
SPEAKER 03 :
The second question is harder. And what is the second question again?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, the second question was you said in one of your blogs or some other time that you believe all the sign gifts, which would be tongues, interpretation of tongues, miracles. Right. Had ceased with the age of the apostles so that when the apostles died, in other words, those gifts are not for today.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay. So, yes. And this is a typical dispensational understanding. You and I went to Dallas Seminary back in the day when it held the classic dispensationalism before it moved to progressive dispensationalism, which I must confess I’m a little bit confused as to exactly what progressive dispensationalism is. Right. But I think even progressive dispensationalism may say that the sign gifts have ceased. I’m not sure. But that to me is a consistent teaching. I’ll give you, MB, several lines of reasoning. First of all, in 2 Timothy 4.20, Paul famously said, Trophimus, I left sick at Miletus. We know Paul had the ability to heal the sick. He even raised the dead on occasion. So how is it that he would leave Trophimus sick at Miletus?
SPEAKER 02 :
Trophimus was one of his trusted co-workers. By the way, and you’re probably going to get to it, he does the same thing with Timothy. You know, with Timothy, he says, drink a little wine for your stomach problems.
SPEAKER 03 :
That’s 1 Timothy 5, right? Right. I think 5.23. Why would he say drink a little wine for your frequent stomach and other ailments if all you need to do is have a healer heal you?
SPEAKER 02 :
That’s right. Particularly when Paul was around him. Right. You know, why not just lay your hands on him and heal him?
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, and of course, back in that day, wine was mixed with water to purify the water. And so sometimes the wine was pure, like when Jesus at the wedding of Cana turned water into wine, he evidently turned it into pure wine. And it was the best wine, according to the head of the wedding feast. The head banquet person said that this was the best wine. But typically, they would mix wine to water, one to one, or maybe two parts water, one part wine, and it purified the water. It also extended the wine. And it also made it harder to get drunk because the wine had much less alcohol content. But in any case, Paul is telling him to drink some wine for his ailments. And he doesn’t say that these ailments show some lack of faith on his part or some problem with not enough healers or whatever.
SPEAKER 01 :
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SPEAKER 03 :
I think 2 Timothy 4.20 and 1 Timothy 5 verse 23 suggest that the sign gifts were falling away by the end of the apostolic age.
SPEAKER 02 :
And can I also say that when you read the epistles, it’s not in there talking about people with healing and talking about tongues. The only reference to tongues in any of the epistles is of early epistle, which is 1 Corinthians. And so why is that the case? If all these gifts are operating, why is there not a single mention of them?
SPEAKER 03 :
That’s a good point. And Ephesians 2.20 says the church is built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Jesus Christ being the cornerstone. So you’ve got this cornerstone, which is Jesus, and then the rest of the foundation is made up of the apostles and the prophets. And the church of Jesus Christ is built on that. That means we don’t have apostles in every generation.
SPEAKER 02 :
Or prophets.
SPEAKER 03 :
And it also means we don’t have prophets in every generation.
SPEAKER 02 :
Because they’re the foundation.
SPEAKER 03 :
Right. And I would argue there will be prophets in the tribulation, but that’s after the church age ends. And there will be people who have the sign gifts during the tribulation, but that’s after the church age ends.
SPEAKER 02 :
I agree. So it’s basically like Acts 2. When Peter quotes from Joel, they’ll see visions. Right. But he’s talking to the nation of Israel there, right? Right. From Joel.
SPEAKER 03 :
And so it seems to me that the two witnesses, you know, who are going to do many of the miracles that Moses did in Egypt or that Elijah did, those are going to be repeated. In fact, some people think that the two witnesses will be the two men who never died, Enoch and Elijah, and then they will die at the midpoint of the tribulation. And then the only people who never died in all of the history of believers would be church age believers who are raptured.
SPEAKER 02 :
And certainly if it’s Elijah, Elijah performed miracles in the Old Testament. Right. And he certainly, whoever these two men are in Revelation, they’re performing miracles.
SPEAKER 03 :
Now, I’d be amiss if I don’t mention 1 Corinthians 13.10. I was taught when I was at Dallas, and you may have heard it too, that 1 Corinthians 13.12 proves that the sign gifts are not today because it says, “…but when that which is perfect has come, then that which is part will be done away.” And I forgot to mention in the preceding verses, he says love never fails, but where there are prophecies, they will fail. In other words, prophecies will end. Where there are tongues, they will cease. So he says straight up. Whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away. That is, the gift of knowledge will go away. For we know in part, and we prophesy in part, but when the perfect is come, that which is in part will be done away. So he’s saying, look, when the perfect comes, we’re going to do away with prophecies, and we’re going to do away with tongues, and we’re going to do away with words of knowledge. Some people say that when the perfect comes refers to the conclusion of the New Testament, the canon of Scripture. And so 70 A.D. came and they had completed the last book of the New Testament, whatever that was. Then those gifts had all ceased.
SPEAKER 02 :
Because we have the revelation. Right. Yeah, that’s what I was taught, too.
SPEAKER 03 :
I don’t hold that view because I think when the perfect comes likely refers to Jesus’ second coming.
SPEAKER 02 :
And charismatics use that to say, well, Jesus hasn’t come yet, so all these gifts are still operating today.
SPEAKER 03 :
Right. And I would say church history shows us and the New Testament shows us the sign gift stopped at the end of the first century. And they will start up again after the rapture, during the tribulation, and then they will cease with the second coming. And I don’t expect to see these gifts during the millennium or on the new earth. So I don’t think 1 Corinthians 13.10 is a good proof text for that. That’s why I say this is harder. We have to go to verses that say, Trofimus, I left sick, take a little wine for your ailments, or the church is built on the apostles and prophets, that sort of thing. We need to be careful because there are a lot of people who think God speaks to them and it leads to a lot of false teaching.
SPEAKER 02 :
And one of the tragic things about believing these gifts are still operating today is people are seeking them. Yeah. And they get into all kinds of weird things. Right. And I’ve seen it so many times, both in the States and particularly overseas. Yeah. You see it a lot. 25-year-old apostles. Oh, yeah. Apostles, prophets. They say they’re raising the dead. And none of it’s true. Well, we appreciate the question. And remember, keep grace in focus.
SPEAKER 01 :
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SPEAKER 02 :
The preceding has been a listener-supported ministry from the Grace Evangelical Society.
