Join us for an in-depth exploration of the Book of Revelation as Bible teacher David Hawking responds to listener questions. Delve into the complex symbols and prophecies, unraveling the mysteries often associated with this profound biblical text. From the meaning of the seven churches to the identity of the two beasts, no stone is left unturned in this eye-opening discussion.
When was the book of Revelation written? Does the book of Revelation tell us about future events only? If there is a multitude of Gentiles who will be saved when Armageddon is upon us, does that mean that people of today will have a second chance when the tribulation is here? And who are the two beasts mentioned in Revelation chapter 13? Well, this is Hope for Today with Bible teacher and author David Hawking. And today, as we reach back into our vast archive of listener letters, listener questions, we put together David’s responses to questions on the book of Revelation. And you may wish to text a friend who loves Bible prophecy to invite them to listen along with you. Just before we get started, you know, we’ve got lots more information and study materials on the book of Revelation on our website, davidhawking.org. So be sure to head over there after today’s broadcast and do take a look at all the video, audio, and books available to you there as well. Your purchase of a resource from Hope for Today helps you and helps the ministry of Hope for Today. Go to the website again, davidhawking.org. All right, let’s get started. Here’s David.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, friends, we’re back with another question and answer program. And what we’ve done this month is assimilate all your questions on the book of Revelation. Now, many of you have our series on it. It’s also an MP3 format, which saves you a lot of money. What do you got there in the way of questions? I know I don’t cover all the questions on Revelation, but we try to take the majority of questions on various issues.
SPEAKER 01 :
The first one here, are the seven churches symbols of church history, seven churches of Revelation?
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah. Now, we have a lot of folks asking that question, and part of the reason, Jim, is that there have been some radio broadcasts out in which that argument was presented. So you start with the church at Ephesus, and they say that’s the apostolic age, first century A.D., and ending with Laodicea, assuming that’s somehow in the 20th now and 21st century. It’s an interesting idea, and I’ve studied it many, many, many times over the years, and My problem with it, Jim, is that there were other churches in Asia Minor, that is, Western Asia Minor. The question is, why did God pick the seven and not mention any others? I think because the seven, each of them are different in terms of the message that God wants to get across to us. These seven churches could exist in any period of time. And to act like one of these, like Ephesus or Smyrna, represents a whole period of church history today. You just can’t prove it. There’s a lack of evidence, and you’re really reading into the passages rather than reading out of them. One other thing, it’s interesting at the end of each of those seven letters that our Lord says, Hear what the Spirit saith to the churches, plural. In other words, the messages, all seven of them, are for all churches to read and understand and apply.
SPEAKER 01 :
Amen. There’s a lesson there for all of us. David, the next question here, when was the book of Revelation written? I heard on one of the national broadcasts that it was written before 70 A.D., and all of its prophecies refer to what happened at the time of the Roman invasion of Israel. Now, is that true?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, we know the source of this, Jim, and we know the broadcast that’s been pushing this. And a lot of people are getting confused. Sometimes, by the way, we’re on the same stations. But I do not believe this is an accurate statement. First of all, there’s not one single historical reference that can be documented. Not one. as to the date of Revelation being written before 70 AD. It’s absolute nonsense. And the contrary is also true. The evidence is overwhelming in church history, not just for general dates, Jim, but an exact date. 95 A.D., which would be 25 years after the Roman invasion. Now, what this argument is doing is they’re trying to say that everything in the book of Revelation that we normally see as future, they say already happened at the time of the Roman invasion and destruction of the temple and city in Jerusalem. Well, folks, it won’t work. Because all of Revelation is written 95 A.D. And from chapter 4, verse 1 to the end of the book, it’s all future. Jim, it’s all future from our day right now. So we need to, you know, stop for a moment and say, is this even possible? We have a whole series of messages called Replacement Theology. One of the messages is called What Happened in 70 A.D.? ? And you will see very clearly that things that were predicted by our Lord, especially in the Olivet Discourse, Matthew 24 and 25, Mark 13, Luke 21, could not possibly have happened in 70 A.D. So we are sorry for all this. We know a lot of people have been confused. They’ve been bombarding us. We also have a little booklet called Replacement Theology, and that has the argument in it, too, about what happened in 70 A.D. Now, it’s inexpensive. It’s only $5, and the tapes are only $20 for the whole series. So, folks, if you just call 1-800-75-BIBLE in the U.S. or in Canada, 1-888-75-BIBLE. Ask for the booklet and the tapes on replacement theology, and I guarantee it will help you greatly. An excellent study.
SPEAKER 01 :
David, the next question here, and we see this quite a bit. How do we know when something is to be taken symbolically or literally?
SPEAKER 03 :
That is one of the finest questions that could be asked about the entire Bible, not just Revelation. In Revelation, folks, we have evidence of abundance of what we call similes. A simile is a short parable. A parable might say a certain man had a farm and he did so-and-so. A simile could be just a simple statement. The righteous are like a green olive tree. The difference between a simile and a metaphor is that the metaphor doesn’t give you a connecting word, like you are the salt of the earth. Does he mean we’re just composed of salt? No. There’s a point there. You are the light of the world. Those are metaphors. But in Revelation, we have tons of similes. Now, a simile always uses one of two connecting words. Either something is like something, or it is as something. His countenance was as the brightness of the sun. Does that mean it’s a sun? Is his face? No. It’s a simile. There’s something about it that is true. So my simple answer is take everything literally, except when there’s symbolic language. And usually the context or other scriptures determine that. There are many, many symbols. Not just parables. There’s fables even in the Bible. There are many, many examples, both metaphors, allegories, similes, all of this. So when you take something literally, you also take literally the figure of speech. If it’s a parable, it’s a parable. There’s a central thought, but we’re not going to make a walk on all fours. So I hope that is helpful to people. Take it literally and take the symbols literally. That means there are symbols. They aren’t that, but there’s something about that that is very important.
SPEAKER 01 :
Amen. David, the next question here, the listener asked, how do we know that from Revelation 4-1 to the end of the book, it is all future?
SPEAKER 03 :
That is a wonderful question, by the way. And that’s being dealt with, too, on some of the national broadcasts that disagree with our view of Revelation being future. Now, from the first three chapters, of course it’s not future. There were seven actual churches in John’s day, and he saw this vision of the glorified Christ in chapter 1. The answer to this question is really found in chapter 1, verse 19, where the outline of the whole book is given. It says, “‘Write the things which thou hast seen.'” Well, what he just saw was the resurrected Christ. Secondly, and the things which are, meaning what existed in John’s day, and those were the seven churches. Then the third part of the outline says, and the things which shall be hereafter, metatauta in Greek, meaning after these things. Now, in Revelation chapter 4 and verse 1, it connects with chapter 1, verse 19, when it says, After this I looked, behold, a door was opened in heaven, and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me, which said, Come up hither, and I’ll show thee things which must be hereafter.” or literally after these things. In other words, chapter 1, verse 19 gives the outline of the whole book, and the third category he clearly marks as beginning in chapter 4, verse 1. So from 4-1, clearly the end of the book is all future. None of it has happened as yet.
SPEAKER 01 :
David, the next question here, very interesting. It says, when do the judgments of Revelation become the, quote, wrath of God, unquote? Does that refer only to the seven last plagues?
SPEAKER 03 :
We had a lot of folks ask this question, and they have continued to ask it. Maybe, Jim, you’ve read that book, Pre-Wrath Rapture of the Church by Marvin Rosenthal. I’ve heard of that, yeah. Yeah, Marv, just a dear guy and a wonderful teacher, and he had a difference of opinion with Friends of Israel years ago, and he had to leave that ministry. They are pre-tribulational, and Marv came to the opinion that The real view of the rapture is pre-wrath. And then he said, on the basis of Revelation 16, that lists these seven bowls of wrath, it says this in verse 1, Chapter 16, I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, go your ways and pour out the vials or the bowls of the wrath of God upon the earth. So he argued that the rapture is pre-wrath, but not pre-tribulational. So the wrath of God would be only the last seven plagues, not the judgments of the seals or the judgments of the trumpets. Now, is that true? We have a lot of folks asking us, Jim, and our answer is no, that is not true, because in the first set of judgments from chapter 6, we have the seven seals, and we have a lot of judgments, and when the sixth seal is opened, there is an enormous earthquake that The sun becomes black as sackcloth of hair. The moon becomes as blood. Stars of the heaven fall to earth. We’re talking about something very serious. Every mountain and island were moved out of their places. The leaders of the earth are trying to hide in the mountains and rocks, and they say, Fall on us and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb. Now, if that weren’t enough, the next verse says, For the great day of his wrath is come, and who shall be able to stand? Folks, the idea that it doesn’t happen until the seven last plagues is incorrect, because The seals, the trumpets, and the bowls are all the wrath of God on planet Earth during the tribulation.
SPEAKER 01 :
It’s a good reason to be ready and to avoid that, eh? Yeah, absolutely. David, next question. If a multitude of Gentiles are going to be saved during the tribulation, then it would appear that people today might have a second chance. Is that true?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, this has been a point of great controversy, and I’m sorry for it, because there are good people on both sides of it. In Revelation 7, we have the two groups, the 144,000 Jews who are sealed by God, protected by God, for their ministry, which in chapter 14 is they’re going to take the everlasting gospel to all nations of the earth. Now, in verse 9 of chapter 7 is where we have this great Gentile multitude that this question comes from. And it’s a multitude who come out of the tribulation and have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb, says verse 14. So this is a great question. Are these people those who have never heard the gospel, or are they those that heard it here but saw the events happening, as they have heard in prophecy conferences, what was going to happen? Do they have a second chance? That is a very fascinating question. And I’m not here— Trying to be dogmatic. Dogmatism, in my opinion, is grown-up puppyism. But anyway, in 2 Thessalonians 2, here’s the problem. 2 Thessalonians 2 speaks about the coming of Antichrist, about the mystery of iniquity working and the wicked one being revealed, and that Satan is going to produce signs and lying wonders in him. Let’s pick it up at verse 10 and listen to these words from verses 10 to 12. and with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish, because they received not the love of the truth that they might be saved, and for this cause God shall send them strong delusion that they should believe a lie. The Greek text says the lie, meaning the lie of the Antichrist, that they all might be damned unrighteously. who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. Folks, I guess we can argue over who these folks are. One, everybody agrees they’re unbelievers before the tribulation begins. But the problem is that if they are rebellious to the gospel that has been presented to them before the tribulation, they will not be among the Gentile multitude who get saved during the tribulation. Why? Because they rejected love for the truth that they might be saved. They believed the lie of the Antichrist, and God says they’ll all be damned because of it. So there is certainly a huge proportion of people who’ve heard the gospel before the tribulation who have not received it, that are rebellious to it, and will not have a second chance. I think we need to be careful here. Well, then who are the people that are going to get saved during the tribulation? A multitude of Gentiles out of every tribe, language, and tongue. Well, we’ve got some 5,000 languages that have yet been not only not reduced to writing but have no Scripture in it. We also have 16,000 people groups that have never had the gospel brought to them. They will hear the gospel during the tribulation. So I’m a little bit uncomfortable with the second chance idea. And for me in my house and all the preaching that I do, I do not assume anything. I want people to get saved and not take any chances. So that’s our view here. I hope it’s helpful.
SPEAKER 01 :
Amen. Amen. David, our next listener question, are the 144,000 only Jews who have never married?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, once again, you know, whoever’s studying Revelation, you guys are pretty sharp. In chapter 7, they are Jews. There are 12,000 from every Jewish tribe. Now, your argument about them being virgins or never married comes from chapter 14, right? where he mentions again the 144,000. And verse four says, these are they which were not defiled with women. Now, if that was all that was said, it means they didn’t commit any adultery, but they could have been married. But the next statement says, for they are virgins. Apparently, there’s 144,000 Jews virgins who don’t have the responsibilities of family during that awful holocaust of terror called the tribulation, and they are the ones God is going to use, seal and protect them, and use them to take the gospel to the whole world. Amen.
SPEAKER 01 :
David, next question. Who are the two beasts mentioned in Revelation chapter 13? Two people you don’t want to know.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah. The first beast that comes up out of the sea, which is an illustration of nations, I think he’s a Gentile, and this beast is connected with the prophecies of Daniel in the opening words of chapter 13, and the whole world is going to worship not only him, but the dragon that gives power to him. And they’re going to say, who is like the beast and who’s able to make war with him? And the descriptions here are right out of Daniel’s prophecies. And those who are going to worship him, verse 8 says, are those whose names are not written in the book of life. That’s why you want to be sure you’re born again, that your name is written in the Lamb’s book of life. Now, the second one that comes up, it’s another beast, but a little different. He has two horns like a lamb but speaks like a dragon. This appears to be a religious person. He’s able to do miracles to deceive people, and he wants them to worship the image of the beast. And he causes everyone… whether they’re rich or poor, small or great, verse 16 says, to receive a mark in their right hand or in their foreheads. So this is probably the best argument here, is that the first piece… is a political global leader. The second one is a religious global leader who encourages everyone to worship the political system.
SPEAKER 01 :
Trevor Burrus From that, David, to what is the mark of the beast, this next listener asked.
SPEAKER 03 :
David Morgan You know, we don’t know. People say, is that a chip? I think the most common question we get on this, is this the chip that they’re putting in animals now and some in animals very limited points of our military. It certainly could be. It certainly could be. But we don’t know that. It’s like reading into the text. All we know is that there’s some mark on your forehead or in your hand. Not both. And it says that no man can buy or sell unless he has the mark. Now, we’re told the mark… is the name of the beast or the number of his name. And that’s where we get the 666. By the way, there are some Greek translations that read 616. rather than 666, but I don’t want to confuse people. I still think the 666 is correct. Some have connected that to the World Wide Web. Others have connected to a person’s name, counting the letters. Some have translated English names back into Hebrew, which had a numbering system for their letters, and trying to come up with this. I think this is all ridiculous, because 2 Thessalonians 2 says – He’s going to be revealed after the saints are gathered together unto the Lord, after the rapture. So I really don’t know. I know it’s some sort of economic block you can’t buy or sell unless you got his name or number.
SPEAKER 01 :
And I think you’ve made a good point. Sometimes we are a little too obsessed with that number and not with the principal star, if you will, of Revelation. That’s the Lord Jesus Christ. Amen.
SPEAKER 03 :
Jim, there’s so many questions here. Let’s plan another broadcast and try to pick up all the rest of these questions. Okay?
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, that is Bible teacher and author David Hawking, and this is a very special edition of the program, our monthly question and answer broadcast. And if you missed any part of today’s program, maybe you heard an answer that David gave to a certain question and you want to hear it again, well, you can do that for a limited time on our website, davidhawking.org, davidhawking.org. Just click on the radio tab and you can see the most recent broadcast. And by the way, while you’re on the website, be sure to check out all of David’s books and booklets, his audio and video lessons, along with several free downloads to help you in your study time. Again, that’s DavidHawking.org. And just before we go, David’s son Matt’s here, and together we’re going to tell you about a book that has answers to many of life’s most perplexing questions.
SPEAKER 02 :
Matt? Each month we air a special program featuring my dad’s answers from the Bible to questions we’ve received from listeners over the years.
SPEAKER 01 :
Yeah, Matt, in your dad’s book, Life’s Greatest Questions, we go to the Bible, the sure word of God. You can always trust God’s word. Yes. We go there for the answers to the perplexities of the human heart.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, the psalmist asked, what is man that thou art mindful of him and the son of man that thou visitest him? Psalm 8, 4. Our Lord cares, and the Bible doesn’t avoid the tough questions, does it, Matt? No. You know, the Lord Jesus declared, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man cometh unto the Father but by me, from John 14, 6. Wow, what a great truth that is. Amen.
SPEAKER 01 :
And if there’s any doubt about it, there it is. Yep. Friend in Him, we find both the meaning of life and the assurance of everlasting life.
SPEAKER 02 :
And you don’t need to remain in darkness concerning life’s greatest questions. God has given us his truth, and in it we find hope, assurance, and peace through his Son, our Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ. And you shall know the truth, Matt.
SPEAKER 01 :
And the truth shall make you free. John 8, 32. Amen. Well, get your copy of Life’s Greatest Questions by David Hawking today for $10 from Hope for Today. Read, enjoy, and then share with a friend who also needs answers. When you purchase this or any resource, would you prayerfully consider adding a donation to help us continue the ministry work of Hope for Today? Or perhaps send a donation by itself. And please do pray for us whenever you hear or remember Hope for Today. To get your copy of Life’s Greatest Questions, call 875-BIBLE, that’s in the U.S., or 888-75-BIBLE in Canada, Bible by the numbers 24253. Or visit our website, davidhawking.org. And we’d love to hear from you as well when you get in touch with us, share a testimony with us, maybe a prayer request, and let us know how God is working in your life as you study the Word with us. And as you get in touch, please do know that your financial support is what keeps this ministry on the air. And if the Lord leads you to give, you can mail your support to Hope for Today, Box 3927, Tustin, California, 92781. If you’re listening in Canada, write to Hope for Today, Box 15011, RPO7OAKS, Abbotsford, B.C., V2S 8P1. Your prayers, your testimonies, and your support mean so much more than I can really, really describe. And thank you so much for getting in touch with us. And as we come to the close of our broadcast today, one of the most encouraging things for us is knowing where you listen from, what city, what station, what time of the day you tune in. and how you first found hope for today. You know, these things help us understand who we’re reaching and how the Lord is using this program in places we may never get to visit. Maybe you listen on your commute, might be at work, maybe during a quiet moment at home. However you join us, we’d be grateful if you’d let us know. Call us at 1-800-75-BIBLE, 1-888-75-BIBLE in Canada, or use the contact form on our website, davidhawking.org. And of course, you can write to us by mail as well. And that’s all for our broadcast today. And next time we continue our Revelation series. So do join us right here on Hope for Today.
Join us for an in-depth exploration of the Book of Revelation as Bible teacher David Hawking responds to listener questions. Delve into the complex symbols and prophecies, unraveling the mysteries often associated with this profound biblical text. From the meaning of the seven churches to the identity of the two beasts, no stone is left unturned in this eye-opening discussion.
